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I need some help, I followed a thread here for a couple of days, it was closed today and it made me angry. The thread started with a VERY positive post with praise and appreciation of the ladies of CERB and it turned very nasty and I don't know how it came to what it did.

 

I'm not looking to rehash the thread, I understand that it got nasty but what I don't get is why this thread elicited comments from members that other similar threads have not.

 

Just so you know where I'm coming from, there are a multitude of posts here asking for recommendations.

 

- Can someone recommend an Asian girl in Ottawa?

 

No problem.

 

- Can someone recommend a BBW in Toronto?

 

No problem

 

- Looking for suggestions for a Duo.

 

No problem.

 

- I love and appreciate all the ladies here on CERB, <sp name> is my favorite, who's yours? Should be a fun thread!

 

Big Problem!

 

For those who haven't read the thread - http://www.cerb.ca/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=107411

 

What I don't understand is why singling out a girl for a recommendation is that different than saying who your favorite is. If you don't want to say who your favorite(s) is I understand, but I don't understand why you would post on the thread. How much different is it than recommending a particular lady of an ethnic group? How do other ladies of that ethnic group feel when you don't recommend them? Or recommending providers of a particular service or whatever, if you give the names of 1 or 2 ladies then there are countless others who are left out.

 

So I'm just wondering why those who responded by saying that it wasn't an appropriate question (and that specific word, appropriate, was not used but clearly implied) think singling out a lady is ok, sometimes. Why did all the previous inquires go unchallenged and this one didn't.

 

 

Just a couple more random comments about the thread.

 

There was some talk of freedom of speech in the thread, CERB is not a democracy, words are censored, people are censored, the MOD(s) decides what can and cannot be said here on CERB and who can and cannot be a member. That doesn't mean people shouldn't enter discussions, just an observation.

 

If you look at the comments on the 2nd post of the thread the OP is called a douchebag, really?, you read the OP and thought douchebag?

 

 

So, again, the posts got nasty which is why the thread got closed, I get that. The OP got defensive which imo is understandable because reading his first post clearly he had good intentions, he could have responded MUCH better in subsequent posts but many senior members stoked the fire as well and I also feel he was ganged up on.

 

In the end I'm not looking for an argument, I'm just curious how the 2 scenarios I've written about are THAT different. Whether you recommend a lady or say a lady is your favorite you are excluding every other SP.

 

Ok that's it, no matter what I got it off my chest :)

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I can understand where the MOD is coming from closing it. Who was right and who was wrong was irrelevant at that point-human beings are often sensitive creatures and we are dealing with physical intimacy here. As much as we are all adults, once certain words are said or feelings perceived, there is sometimes no going back. It looked as though the misunderstanding was snowballing and growing more and more personal. Best to bury it before things got out of hand further. Again, this doesn't look like a matter of free speech so much as protecting people on both sides of the issue from themselves. Many of us have seen threads begin innocently and then spiral into absurdity and degenerate into name calling, sometimes with members being suspended. My advice is to let it rest.

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Lowdark I agree with everything you said, well almost :) I understand why the thread was closed, I understand that innocent threads can sometimes go off the rails. I don't want this to be an extension of that thread. I'm truly trying to understand why recommending a SP is ok but saying she's your favorite is not ok. I could understand if it was asked in a disrespectful way but in this case it wasn't. At the risk of sounding corny, I'm really trying to learn something here.

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Guest V***s*aP*I

My only problem with the original post was the use of the word "BEST" in the title. And then when other users tried to explain why they wouldn't be able to describe "BEST" or favourite the OP decided to bitch the guys out instead of either ignoring it or correcting their interpretation of his original post.

 

Then it just kind of went all to shit after that with a lot of people to blame as to why it went that way. But that is the nature of massage boards, someone may misinterpret what one says, or offer an opinion that isn't wanted. The thread is gone time to leave it alone and move on.

 

That being said, my favourite SP is Aubreyxx. . .I haven't seen her but shes so nice and sweet so she's my fave!!

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I read the previous thread, I see nothing wrong with asking questions of others, and the question was fine, and I do think that some gents have favourites, maybe not just one, but perhaps a small handful.

 

As to general protocol, I think if you are asked a question, and you don't personally feel you can or want to answer it, because you don't want to be in an awkward position, then the easiest thing to do is just not reply. It is not like you have to reply to every thread.

 

Maybe we should think of the general motto of the board, "if you don't have something nice to say, say nothing", and apply that more broadly than just the recommendations.

 

Just my perspective on things.

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I think the reaction towards out of province comments was the bigger issue, and the repeated use of word stupid when adressing his dissinterest in their comments.

Had the original question been who is your favorite sp and why? Instead of who is the best? It may not have caused a debate..... I'm assuming mod closed the thread to prevent more mean things being said from both sides. After all it is thanksgiving and the thread had been going in a very negative direction.

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Had the original question been who is your favorite sp and why? Instead of who is the best? It may not have caused a debate.....

 

Maybe it was the title that people did not like.

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Guest Ou**or**n

The board has a history of sensitivity to threads with with the word 'BEST' in the title. Some examples included the best bums thread, the best album thread and so on. They have a history. As an adult I understand that BEST is probably meant interchangeably with FAV as by its very nature BEST is subjective opinion. However the sensitivity remains as it can be taken as a term that is competitive or excludes people instead of simply highlighting favorites.

 

The comments about posts from members outside Winnipeg just threw fuel on the fire. Once those comments were made the thread was doomed and mod correctly nipped it in the bud.

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The comments about posts from members outside Winnipeg just threw fuel on the fire. Once those comments were made the thread was doomed and mod correctly nipped it in the bud.

 

 

I agree, but question why action wasn't directed at the OP, who was clearly out of line. Censorship over discipline?

 

I personally had no issue with the original post, but for the reasons you cited, still felt it was going to cause a stir.

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First, I truly believe the intent of the thread was positive.

But here lies the difference.

When you post a recommendation, you are posting why an encounter you had with a certain lady was enjoyable.

It is so to speak, a snapshot in time, when you were with a specific lady. A recommendation doesn't compare one lady against all others. It is just about the encounter you had with a specific lady.

In the case when you answer a question, "can you recommend a____" (fill in the blank)

you can answer based on your experience. For instance, if the question was can you recommend a spinner, you can answer by providing names of all spinners you have seen and had good encounters with. Also, quite often, when those questions are asked, the poster will say you can PM me.

But asking who the very best lady is you saw. Well if one lady is the best, by inference it can be taken to mean by the other ladies they were worse. Even though their names not mentioned, those ladies will feel offended by not being named in this list. I'm not a ladies man, no Romeo, not great with lines. But this much I do know about women. What lady doesn't like to be complimented and flattered.

And how uncomplimentary and unflatteirng it must be to not be included on a client's "who's the best" list. Even if not public, the ladies not listed may be offended and hurt.

Like I said, I truly believe the thread was started with the best of intentions

but would imho cause hurt for many unnamed ladies

My take on the subject

RG

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First, I truly believe the intent of the thread was positive.

But here lies the difference.

When you post a recommendation, you are posting why an encounter you had with a certain lady was enjoyable.

It is so to speak, a snapshot in time, when you were with a specific lady. A recommendation doesn't compare one lady against all others. It is just about the encounter you had with a specific lady.

In the case when you answer a question, "can you recommend a____" (fill in the blank)

you can answer based on your experience. For instance, if the question was can you recommend a spinner, you can answer by providing names of all spinners you have seen and had good encounters with. Also, quite often, when those questions are asked, the poster will say you can PM me.

But asking who the very best lady is you saw. Well if one lady is the best, by inference it can be taken to mean by the other ladies they were worse. Even though their names not mentioned, those ladies will feel offended by not being named in this list. I'm not a ladies man, no Romeo, not great with lines. But this much I do know about women. What lady doesn't like to be complimented and flattered.

And how uncomplimentary and unflatteirng it must be to not be included on a client's "who's the best" list. Even if not public, the ladies not listed may be offended and hurt.

Like I said, I truly believe the thread was started with the best of intentions

but would imho cause hurt for many unnamed ladies

My take on the subject

RG

 

Well RG I see what you're saying and I will agree to disagree.

 

Although I think too much was made about the title I respect the fact that each of us can read the same thing and take away different things.

 

I think OutForFun made a great point about BEST=FAV since best is subjective. As an aside best bj/dt threads always annoy me :)

 

Well ok, I think I know what triggered the responses, obviously a better response from the OP could changed things but I think he got defensive after starting what he thought would be an interesting thread.

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Well, cerb is a great place, but it sure seems we have reached a very, very weird place when a "who's the best escort" thread gets closed on the Canadian Escort Recommendation Board. uggh. Cmon guys ... we are taking ourselves waaaaay too seriously around here.

 

Also, any response to a "best" thread is obviously nothing more than an opinion as these aren't objective measures. My opinion as to best (which I respectfully decline to offer because I personally dont want other ladies that I have seen on cerb to think they are somehow not as good ... which isn't true) is going to obviously differ from others.

 

Topics like this can get to be a lot of fun, with great stories attached. And as to a "best clients" thread, I'm all for it! That way, the guys here can harrass the other guys who get mentioned. (wink)

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I agree with the above.

The word "BEST" may have been throwing some off, but in truth it could only be seriously discussed if every poster had exprienced EVERY SP. It meant "best to them"....= favourite. I dont think the ladies here are that thin skinned to feel hurt by something like that. As mentioned, if I see a post/thread that has nothing to do with, or has no interest for me, I usually just pass on reading it, let alone commenting on it.

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Even in "civilian" life, I seldom read any piece opining on the best of anything - best universities in Canada, best Canadian province to live in, best country in the world etc etc. In fact when I first came across the original OP ( and before responses to it had become "animated") I did not continue reading the thread the moment I realized that it was dealing with best escorts. I went back to read the entire thread only after billybob's piece had resurrected it. Writers of such "best" pieces can be placed in one of two categories - an innocuous group ( out to provoke light-hearted discussion - as the original OP in this case) and a sinister group (who, at best may be self-serving and at worst, may be out to pursue an evil agenda). The reality is that people are so diverse in their circumstances that there can be no objective standard of "bestness" in anything. My guess is that the responses that were seen as "too serious" could have been precipitated by the writer of the OP or others implying that Cerbites not living in Winnipeg have no business commenting on a Winnipeg issue for I am sure that Cerbites are sophisticated enough to realize that there are very few objective truths in this world. Usually what passes for "truth" are just the views of someone or some group with power. Such ones use their power to persuade or force others to adopt their view as the truth.

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What I don't understand is why singling out a girl for a recommendation is that different than saying who your favorite is.

 

Because saying "X is the best SP" is not the same as saying "X is my favourite", and neither of those is the same as "X is very good and I recommend her".

 

The last of those... a simple recommendation is uncontroversial. It says something positive about the person who's recommended, and nothing at all about anything else.

 

But both of the first two are making judgements... they're judging that not only is X good, but that everyone else is inferior - and that's what annoys people. At least someone announcing their particular favourite is implicitly acknowledging that this is their subjective judgement, and the potential consequences of implicitly putting down everyone else are theirs to bear.

 

But announcing that "X is the best"... I see at least three problems with that. First, as with a personal preference, it puts down everyone else. Second, it assumes that there is some objective definition of "best", which I think is an assumption that most of us would question. And thirdly, it's arrogant in its assumption that any one person actually knows the objective definition of "best". Any of these might annoy some people; the combination of all three pretty much guarantees that you're going to annoy a lot of people.

 

On other questions that get asked... people asking for specific recommendations/suggestions on who to see are often (not always, but often) looking for something quite specific. People are asking for an ethnicity, or a particular service, or in a particular location (or some combination of those) The request being made quite often naturally excludes most of the people here, and most of the SPs who do fit the requirements will often be suggested (at least, that's been my experience of threads like this where I've actually had a good idea of what the possible answers actually --are--). But yes, sometimes we get much more general questions (like "looking for a SP in Ottawa", for example), and when things like that come in the collective answer is often a far more general one ("go read the reco section and the ads") than suggestions for particular people.

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Because saying "X is the best SP" is not the same as saying "X is my favourite", and neither of those is the same as "X is very good and I recommend her".

The last of those... a simple recommendation is uncontroversial. It says something positive about the person who's recommended, and nothing at all about anything else.

 

But both of the first two are making judgements... they're judging that not only is X good, but that everyone else is inferior - and that's what annoys people. At least someone announcing their particular favourite is implicitly acknowledging that this is their subjective judgement, and the potential consequences of implicitly putting down everyone else are theirs to bear.

 

But announcing that "X is the best"... I see at least three problems with that. First, as with a personal preference, it puts down everyone else. Second, it assumes that there is some objective definition of "best", which I think is an assumption that most of us would question. And thirdly, it's arrogant in its assumption that any one person actually knows the objective definition of "best". Any of these might annoy some people; the combination of all three pretty much guarantees that you're going to annoy a lot of people.

 

On other questions that get asked... people asking for specific recommendations/suggestions on who to see are often (not always, but often) looking for something quite specific. People are asking for an ethnicity, or a particular service, or in a particular location (or some combination of those) The request being made quite often naturally excludes most of the people here, and most of the SPs who do fit the requirements will often be suggested (at least, that's been my experience of threads like this where I've actually had a good idea of what the possible answers actually --are--). But yes, sometimes we get much more general questions (like "looking for a SP in Ottawa", for example), and when things like that come in the collective answer is often a far more general one ("go read the reco section and the ads") than suggestions for particular people.

 

Well I was going to address your post point by point but I'll just address it generally.

I just think way to much was made about a word, best. I started this thread for a reason and now I'm glad I did because now I understand the real genesis of the issue.

 

From previous posts there is an aversion here to using the word best, there seems to be a history with using the word as well.

 

I think Kubirckfan and bewlayb made great points, people shouldn't get too upset about using the word best. IMO best=fav because it's an opinion, if you disagree then we have a disagreement, no need to go back and forth I've stated my point of view and you've stated yours.

 

It also seems the men of the board are more concerned than the ladies are about this. Maybe some guys feel the need to be protective but I have no doubt that the ladies here on CERB can fend for themselves. There's another thread here talking about jealousy between the ladies and generally speaking most have no issues because they are confident in who they are and the services they provide. I'm sure if I stated who my best/fav SP was they wouldn't be hurt. They know there's a lot of their clients who would pick them, they show their fav/best SP that by being a regular.

 

Btw I appreciate all the feedback, whether we agree or not.

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Just a few extra pennies on the issue. I agree with previous opinions specifying the difference between a recommendation (writing about how you may have enjoyed the time spent with a particular lady and encouraging others to do so) and stating who the best/your fav is (elevating one above the others). The reason I believe topics like this are so controversial is because judging who's the "best" is so subjective. It's like professional sports, ask someone who best NHL team is and they'll tell you who their favourite team is based on their highly subjective criteria. This becomes an even more sensitive issue given that the ladies themselves are so diverse, and may or may not have different levels of chemistry given the hobbiest who is visiting them. In short, there is no way to define "best" (just peruse the internet after the Oscars every year to get an idea of how widely the definition of best varies). And perhaps that's why some people might get a bit touchy-they may fear applying a label that cannot be either justified nor defended may make some of the ladies feel unappreciated. I doubt this was the intent, but this may be how others perceive it.

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I must confess to not having paid too much attention to this issue, but I don't see the thread being closed as really having much to do with the question of whether it was about the "best" SP in Winnipeg. I also don't see it as being about political correctness.

 

It seems to me it had to do with the tenor of the posts, which were becoming rather rude and disrespectful. Essentially, a fight was developing, and the MOD decided to shut it down. Correct decision in my opinion. The fact that the OP, who was the primary bad actor in terms of disrespectful discourse, has been suspended would seem to confirm that.

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I must confess to not having paid too much attention to this issue, but I don't see the thread being closed as really having much to do with the question of whether it was about the "best" SP in Winnipeg. I also don't see it as being about political correctness.

 

It seems to me it had to do with the tenor of the posts, which were becoming rather rude and disrespectful. Essentially, a fight was developing, and the MOD decided to shut it down. Correct decision in my opinion. The fact that the OP, who was the primary bad actor in terms of disrespectful discourse, has been suspended would seem to confirm that.

 

I knew why the thread was closed, the point of this thread was why the comments (respectful comments btw) were made in the first place. I was wondering why some members chose not to participate in the thread but to question whether or not the topic should even be broached.

 

I think I am reading the responses correctly and the reason those who chose to comment did so was because they felt that asking who the "best" SP is, is not an appropriate question.

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I knew why the thread was closed, the point of this thread was why the comments (respectful comments btw) were made in the first place. I was wondering why some members chose not to participate in the thread but to question whether or not the topic should even be broached.

 

I think I am reading the responses correctly and the reason those who chose to comment did so was because they felt that asking who the "best" SP is, is not an appropriate question.

 

Billy -- not so sure about that; maybe mod will fill us in but as porthos mentions the OP has been suspended, so hopefully it has more to do with the other stuff in that string rather than the "best" issue. Just would seem to be the height of irony not to be able to have a "best SP" ... or "best client" ... thread on an escort-related message board.

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I think there are real variations in the way different regional sections of the board operate. I've noticed in the past, in a number of sections, posts that are asking for "opinions" about specific girls. Often, the discussion section seems to operate almost like a "review" section. People don't post overtly negative comments, but they sometimes will say things like "stay away from her" or "I wouldn't see her" followed by a "pm me for details". At the same time, some of the regional sections have very few actual recommendations.

 

This is just a casual observation, but I think it does have some importance for this discussion. The question of "best" invites comparisons and potentially blurs into a "review" type assessment.

 

In part, I think those that commented were reflecting their own disquiet with the framing of the question, and it's potential to run counter to the ethos of the board. It strikes me that had this discussion happened in the general discussion forum, we'd all be fine with it. I also understand the OPs "reaction" to outsiders ... I lived in Winnipeg for a long time myself. But the board isn't structured that way and the reaction was over the top. In many sections we find discussions about the hobby, how hobbyists should conduct themselves, etc., etc. Not just in the general discussion section. I've always felt quite comfortable participating in those discussions. I've commented in the Ottawa section, winnipeg section, New Brunswick and Nova Scotia sections. Don't live in any of those places. I still go back and drop in on the NL section, even though I live in Southern Ontario now.

 

So I think there are a lot of things going on in the thread that was closed. I don't think it was anyone's intention to impose a form of political correctness. Rather, it was to try and highlight that the way the thread was framed might upset people (particularly ladies or even other hobbyists). Had the OP not overreacted, I suspect the thread might still be going on and discussion going forward.

 

Just a bit of ramble as my pumpkin pies are baking.

 

Porthos

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Had the OP not overreacted, I suspect the thread might still be going on and discussion going forward.

 

What discussion? Certainly not the discussion the OP had intended when he started the thread.

 

Had the thread not been jumped on to express a few hang-ups over the B-word, we probably would have seen 25-30 happy hobbyists highlighting 30-35 of their favorite ladies (yes, B-word notwithstanding, some would likely name more than one). And what would have been wrong with that??

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What discussion? Certainly not the discussion the OP had intended when he started the thread.

 

Had the thread not been jumped on to express a few hang-ups over the B-word, we probably would have seen 25-30 happy hobbyists highlighting 30-35 of their favorite ladies (yes, B-word notwithstanding, some would likely name more than one). And what would have been wrong with that??

 

Amen. Nothing would have been wrong with that.

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Billybob, if the closing of the last thread pissed you off then the closing of this thread will send you over the moon. The thread was closed for a reason and if you were looking for sympathy by starting this thread up, where you claim you didn't want to rehash the thread even thought that's exactly what happened. Well that blew up in your face.

 

Grandstanding will not get you very far on this site especially when you do so in the face of the moderator team at CERB. Threads get closed all the time, this site is for everyone, get over it and next time you have a concern about a decision made by a moderator contact them by pm. Publicly shaming the moderator team will only get you a spot alongside 2inthepink.

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