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You can't really write an honest review on Lyla if it is anything other than a recommendation.

I have found external reviews on other sites to be very useful when deciding who to avoid.

I wasn't going to answer this question when I read it last night but I feel like I want to now.

 

It's one thing to ask questions like how married clients justify seeing escorts because we answer about ourselves but to ask how to be a good escort smacks of complete arrogance when asked by a client. Of course we all have preferences on physical attributes and type of encounters we like but our preferences do not determine the basis to what constitutes a good escort.

 

The "being a good client" thread is useful, especially to newbies, because it allows us to understand how these types of encounter work. There is not a lot of talk about all of this is the outside world. Knowing how to be good client helps booking time with an escort, which leads to sex and other fun stuff which means that we leave the incall with a big goofy grin of happiness! There are no negative downsides to that!

 

 

This is a business so obviously good business practices are required to be successful just like any other business but it also a very unique business that involves humans sharing very intimate moments. It's not like ordering a pizza and the mere fact that comparison was made is wrong at many levels.

 

I think that as clients if we do our research and communicate well we will find a good match. There are no contractual agreements here, we can ask to visit again or not ask and the escort can say yes or no.

 

Additional Comments:

I wasn't going to answer this question when I read it last night but I feel like I want to now.

 

It's one thing to ask questions like how married clients justify seeing escorts because we answer about ourselves but to ask how to be a good escort smacks of complete arrogance when asked by a client. Of course we all have preferences on physical attributes and type of encounters we like but our preferences do not determine the basis to what constitutes a good escort.

 

The "being a good client" thread is useful, especially to newbies, because it allows us to understand how these types of encounter work. There is not a lot of talk about all of this is the outside world. Knowing how to be good client helps booking time with an escort, which leads to sex and other fun stuff which means that we leave the incall with a big goofy grin of happiness! There are no negative downsides to that!

 

 

This is a business so obviously good business practices are required to be successful just like any other business but it also a very unique business that involves humans sharing very intimate moments. It's not like ordering a pizza and the mere fact that you even said that is wrong at so many levels.

 

I think that as clients if we do our research and communicate well we will find a good match. There are no contractual agreements here, we can ask to visit again or not ask and the escort can say yes or no.

Cleanliness, punctuality, and not caking on the makeup/lying about their age, how are those "preferences"?

You are absolutely right, it's not like ordering a pizza. Pizza is an object, it's more like calling a plumber ;)

Additional Comments:

So, to be clear, you felt the "How to be a good client" thread was petty and insulting, and felt that the best way to convey your disapproval was to start a second thread that was equally petty and insulting, but targeting providers?

 

That's a fairly revealing statement.

 

Clients and providers are not in comparable situations. A client can view photographs, research reviews and assure himself of the reputation of a provider. Some choose not to and instead endlessly troll BP and cl for "deals" but that's at their discretion. A client can also elect not to go through with an appointment without financial detriment. You can walk away if a provider has misrepresented herself, or is late. You can vote with your feet.

 

Providers, conversely, can attempt to use some sort of screening to vet clients, but have far less discretion over who shows up. Regular reminders about hygiene, courtesy, and punctuality are sadly necessary. Many clients start off unaware of expectations, or make a game of fake bookings.

 

I've even heard that, on occasion, some are quite deliberately petty and insulting.

You take this way too seriously white knight, I'm just having a chuckle :biggrin:

Additional Comments:

To our White Knights who have delightfully replied...I salute you. To the OP, it should be apparent that the ladies of Lyla have no desire to engage with you on any level here. Such thread topics are so obviously in bad taste, it's hard to believe you don't see it. My gentle suggestion would be for you to give deep consideration to how genuinely insightful your thread topics and posts are to providers...

 

smiles, cat

Do you really think I would reveal my user name to providers?

I'm a perfect gentleman in real life, you'll never know it was me that ruffled your feathers online ;)

Additional Comments:

<....crickets chirping in the silence that is the rush to join in....>

the client has a number of rights....right to read up on..look at, perrrrusing sites and information...the right to 'yay or nay'..the right to decide what it is they are.interested in....and more....

But...my dear boy, this is not a business run like a pizza joint or a plumbing place...or a 7-11 or anything else....if anything, it can be likened to purrrrchasing something sight unseen from a want ad....all you have to go on is the information the seller wants you to have or feels you need...and ultimately it is buyer beware....obviously not the rule but...I'm also thinking you may not have much to worry about as far as *you not being able.to support the industry*...as you're certainly coming off as the wrong sort of client....with the bristling attitude....try something new. ...have a converrrrsation rather than always trying to bait and argument. This is not a thread on how to be a good escort <ha!>...it's another turning into all about you...

Yeah, I know what it "IS". I'm just saying it would be great if it was above board and run like a proper business, though I'm sure there are many escorts who play by proper business rules even though they don't need to. What makes escorting so special that it shouldn't be regulated and above board, why don't escorts need to play by the rules that every other business owner does?

Don't worry dear, I don't contact escorts with my lyla handle, in real life I'm a perfect gentleman, the internet is the only place I can actually get away this kind of crap :biggrin:

Additional Comments:

The worst of the false advertising is probably when the older gals cake on the makeup for the photoshoot, and then don't bother to wear any for the main event.

I've seen 2 girls that did that and the makeup easily concealed 10-15 years of wrinkliness (you can guess which age they used in their ad too ;) )

I don't have a problem with it, we all get wrinkly eventually, but if your going to fake it in the photos then why would you think it would go over well when you show up without it?

And the moment you start agitating for "customer's rights" and referring to white knights in a derogatory fashion, I have utterly lost interest in anything you have to say.

 

Of course there is a transaction at the heart of this, and clients have reasonable expectations of safety, privacy, cleanliness and so forth. On a recommendations board, those are assumed. Their absence is cause for a post on a warning thread.

 

So called "white knights" simply believe that the women in this profession do not forfeit their right to respect as fully autonomous persons.

 

If you are unable to understand that the basic tenor of this thread is disrespectful, and that you should aspire to be a "white knight" whether or not you engage in this community, I would suggest that you are on the wrong forum.

Perhaps I am, but you still don't have a leg to stand on.

Why is it okay to tell clients they should bathe, be respectful, and other obvious things, but it's a great crime to mention that escorts should do the same? I've met myriad girls with unnecessary delays/excuses, unwashed, and just generally carrying a sense of entitlement because why not, they hold all the cards ;)

The warning/reporting threads are little more than decoration around here, I've tried to utilize this in the past to report a dangerous encounter/theft to no avail, even after messaging the moderator directly requesting advice. That dangerous escort is still unknown to this community, and will remain so, because I do not share undeserved information ;)

To be honest I think both forum threads are rather petty and insulting, I just wanted to see if anyone would make the connection or if they would automagically jump to the defense of one and condemn the other.

You might have proven my suspicions my good man ;)

I'm not going to reply directly to either of you, my goal here is none other than to speak my mind within the rules, contribute to the community via escort recommendations, and gather whatever information I find useful.

I only need an account here for 2 of the 3, so getting along with everyone isn't necessarily in my best interests.

This thread only mirror's the "how to be a good client" thread, which I've found useful in the past.

Perhaps escorts new to the game might find some use in this thread, in any case you really can't argue against this thread without condemning the other.

In summary, you may sheath your swords white knights, I'm sure the ladies can handle themselves ;)

Additional Comments:

I've been here for a few years and I've seen some threads turn into rants. Some of them go on for 75 pages of posts discussing bad behaviour. Those qualify as rants to me.

 

Btw, if you didn't mean to imply that ordering a woman is like ordering a pizza, then it was a bad analogy to use. ������

 

Prufrock has some good advice for getting along in here, if that's your goal. I'm fine with you disagreeing with me. I sometimes like a heated debate as well, but I pick my battles carefully, otherwise I just come across as argumentative.

 

Good luck.

The business analogy applies, a service provider is a service provider regardless of their trade.

Let's go with a plumber analogy instead then ;)

If my toilet is clogged, I'd prefer the plumber be punctual, or offer a free plumbing.

Until escorting is above board clients won't really have any customer rights though, so I suppose I'm just talking at the wind :p

Additional Comments:

Can I borrow a shovel :biggrin:

Sure, I`m poking a bit of fun here, but it is honest fun. It can certainly be argued that our beloved escorts hold all the cards when it comes to how well they run their business, no accountability whatsoever. I`m not really sure I can even support the industry any more until I see some customer rights. We can form a client rights union gents, who`s with me?

I sometimes get annoyed with these type threads but I get it, quite often guys are new to this lifestyle and don't understand what is appropriate behaviour. It can be useful to inform us. Sometimes though, these threads seem to just become a place to rant endlessly.

 

I'm not sure if your thread will be useful, 0000, if your thread intention becomes endless ranting as well.

 

I will say I have experienced some issues on your list and they can be annoying. However, I do not expect honesty. You are buying a fantasy which, by it's very purpose, is not real or honest. These women have every right to withhold who they really are from us. Hell, even in "civilian" relationships people are guarded about showing their true selves to their partner until trust is built. Maybe you just worded it poorly and meant something else? Honesty isn't part of this deal.

 

Also, immediate response is nice but how do you know the person is not otherwise detained. They have lives outside this business and for many, it is just part time. Shit happens. Learn to adapt or be permanently pissed off at the world.

 

Not to stray off topic but this immediacy in communication is a product of technology. It creates high expectations and entitlement, that really have no place in this lifestyle, or other personal relationships, in my opinion. Being old school, I sometimes lament where things are heading.

 

Take care

Has the other thread become an endless rant?

I found it useful back when I was a newbie.

I suppose honesty is tricky, I should specify honesty in advertising.

I think there are reasonable excuses for most anything on my list. Of course I don't expect someone to divulge their personal life story or miss a medical emergency/death in the family to take my call.

I just added the response thing in there because I recently confirmed an appointment with someone 2 days ago, and they didn't show up at all after 2 hours. I sent them one final text that they still haven't replied to.

I wasn't badgering them either, just a couple texts wondering when they would be showing up.

I respectfully disagree, I think it's just common courtesy for someone running a business to be on time and to communicate. If I order a pizza and it shows up 45 minutes late or not at all, I get a free pizza (and no ladies I am not saying it is like ordering a pizza :) )

Really I couldn't resist. Not sure if this will go over as well as the "How to be a good client" thread, but it's worth a try.

Not really too much difference between this and the other thread, but I'm sure plenty of people will have good suggestions that I haven't thought of.

Here's my personal list:

Honesty, client's should want to see you for who you are, not for who you want to imply you are.

Cleanliness, that includes yourself and your incall ;)

Be respectful, and attentive, make sure your client feels comfortable with discussing their desires in your company.

Be on time and communicate, can't put into words how frustrating it is when someone is 2 hours late and won't even return a text, grrrrr.

That's it for me, have fun with it folks!

...Like your own personal biases? If you didn't want a discussion, then you shouldn't have asked for one. But you did, in posting on an online forum, where people may disagree with you, and may have opinions that contradict your own. You yourself admit to being young and not very experienced, yet you are not open at all to hearing more than one biased voice -- your own.

 

Not at all Kathryn. I am happy to hear dissenting opinions, but you need to at least address what I have written and explain your reasoning.

It appears that you didn't take the time to read what I have written before making assumptions about my experience with this woman. You are quick to jump to her defense, and assume that I just didn't communicate well enough or that I just didn't enjoy myself and wasn't willing to submit to her.

Those assumptions aren't in line with my experience, nor the discussion I have started here. I didn't just have a bad experience, I had issues with establishing the line between consensual and non consensual domination. I didn't have my boundaries disrespected because I was unwilling to communicate with this woman beforehand, the line of communication simply wasn't offered to me beforehand (which is admittedly when I should have walked away).

Even then I do encourage experimentation in encounters of this type. I don't take issue with her working in fun activities that I hadn't considered, but if she is going to do so then she shouldn't be surprised when the immersion in the role play is occasionally broken, to establish boundaries.

You are correct in that it is wrong of me to think I can just stop the discussion now, and I do welcome your input, but you first need to understand my point of view by carefully reading what I have written, before you can provide a convincing argument for your own point of view.

My main point of argument here is that a safe word should always be an option and should always be respected. If a particular provider doesn't like having the immersion broken by use of a safe word, even when she is trying things that I haven't agreed to, then I'll just politely move on to someone else. Perhaps others will get along just fine with this woman if they do not feel the need to enforce their limits in the way I chose to.

I'm aware there are some who give up access to safe words and limits entirely, even choosing to enter into 24/7 dom/sub relationships. Personally I think they are insane, but to each their own right?

I think there's a pretty discernible difference between verbal 'domination' and verbal 'humiliation', being domination is easily terms of possessiveness, right? Eluding to the idea that you belong to her. Joking about your capabilities as a lover has nothing to do with her domination of you. Even if that had been a misunderstanding, she shouldn't have argued it with you after, instead she should have understood the position & power imbalance she had put you in and apologized... and absolutely never repeated that action.

 

Her apparently repeated efforts to ignore you consent and safe words is highly concerning, and dangerous for practitioners of BDSM. The first time someone openly disregards your consent is when you should immediately drop the session and see if you can obtain a refund (so you hopefully don't have to just cut your losses).

 

I'm so sorry you went through that, those experiences can be traumatic and can turn even worse so, so easily.

I completely agree, it certainly gave me some psychological issues to work through, as I did enjoy the activities and feel conflicted that I enjoyed domination from someone I couldn't put my trust in.

I wasn't about to try and negotiate a refund though, the law may not be entirely on my side if she were to get them involved, and I wasn't feeling in the mood to be standing up to a woman who is actually more physically imposing than I am :p

I'm not going to pretend i'm not partly responsible for this. I should have talked more to her on the phone, maybe I would have caught onto her tone and reconsidered before I even went to see her.

As to the 'not a real domme if there's cuddling et al' comment....I dote on my submissives. ....very much enjoy doing so....as they enjoy being.doted upon....and have no intention of ever denying.either myself or.them that part.of things. I've always done that....and find it rather insulting....both as a pro-domme...and one who is very much immersed in that lifestyle and.culture, to have it inferred that I'm not (or those who may be like me)...a *real* domme.

 

Ask the man who's jaw I grip in my hand, whispering soft comforting thins to as I drive my knee.into his testicles hard enough in one shot to knock him to the.floor....if I am not real....

Or purrrrhaps the lovely little man who adores when I coo harsh words, call him names....while stuffing his @ass to the point of having him in tears....softly stroking.his hair the whole.time....if I am not *real*..... or...hehe the wonderful man who lives in new York, who sees me.when hes here...and who's every move I still control....while.referring.to him as 'My Beloved'....if I am not *real* (I could.go further hehe but....)

 

As many different people there are out there...there are as many different dommes/subs....and dynamics.....yours or your 'idea' of how they 'should' go...is likely.just as different. Does not mean they don't exist..or aren't *real*.... yikes.... no one person should (or can) say someone is wrong to be happy or.enjoy what they are obviously excited about.

 

As to the 'contract'....it is *not* the same.as.getting.something in writing outlining soft/hard limits....comfort. zones, expectations (from either party...not just one)....this would be what is more.known as written consent.....a *contract*...mostly.in the traditional sense....means you are *owned*....not what you have agreed.to and/or have previously.discussed insofar as how a scene is going to play out.... most experienced domme/doms would know that ;)

 

I he is pleased.and feels.comfortable with who he has found.....then again I have to say *yay*....and enjoy all that the experience can/should bring you *both*..no matter what the dynamic ends up being. Nay-Sayers be damned ;)

 

(Brief Internet access tonight so...hehe)

 

<....stalks softly into dark warm trees....under millions.of stars..... gone..... for now...>

My goodness that is some beautiful imagery, why does Winnipeg have to be so very far away from Nova Scotia :icon_sad:

Very good points as well, how incredibly insulting for someone to assume that emotional disconnect is what makes a "real" "professional" dominatrix, particularly since "professional" only indicates they require monetary compensation for their time.

Last I checked, I am very much expected to pay for the experience :D

Additional Comments:

Have you heard of the term "topping from the bottom"?

 

These sort of things need to be clearly communicated and negotiated before a session, otherwise, I can understand how this didn't go how you expected, and I can also understand how she would also have felt exasperated, if what you were doing seemed like you were trying to control the scene.

Either you agree that use of a safeword is nothing to be ashamed of when the sub believes boundaries have been crossed, or you do not agree with this. If you do not agree with this then you are free to find someone else to dominate.

Never mind the fine details, or how often I may have used the safe word, that wasn't my point in this discussion and that should be evident if you read my words.

I certainly communicated my desires and boundaries before the roleplay. It is ridiculous to expect the sub to foresee all of the possible activities the dom might choose to engage in, and to address them all clearly before the roleplay. I am not a mind reader, that's precisely why safe words exist.

Address the argument, don't try and twist the words and veer off into some other discussion, it is very much a black and white topic.

Perhaps if she had bothered to listen to what I had to say in open communication before the roleplay, then we wouldn't have had a problem.

I didn't halt the scene momentarily to demand that she do this, or do that. I very much submitted to her control throughout right up until she crossed the line (and even after the second time she crossed the line)

Someone who wishes complete control at all times and is not open to non coercive communication before or even during a roleplay is not a dominatrix, they would better fit the definition of a sociopath.

Discussing details of this encounter was probably a mistake on my part, so I will no longer do so.

It is obvious that personal biases are playing a role in some of the responses I am getting here.

Much less demanding? Try 'not demanding at all'.

 

That is the point of escorts versus affairs, or even FWB encounters. The point of escort/client is that emotions and jealousy is not part of it, nor is friendship and romantic love.

 

You clearly have a lot to learn about the difference between seeing escorts and anything else,.

 

 

I also would like to point out that polyamory is not the same thing as something like polygamy. Just because someone has sexual encounters with others doesn't mean it is polyamory. just because someone may have multiple wives, doesn't mean it is all about love either. That's a key element when factoring some cultures, where the marriage is not a love match, it is an arrangement and contract. this contract does not include fidelity, as far as I know. It includes a life long commitment, financially at least, and children. maybe connecting two families and two incomes for a better life for both their parents and their children, but it doesn't mean love.

 

And as C says, you don't 'pay for' emotions and emotional intimacy. If you want/need that, you do it with a GF or dating or your family. i'm not saying there is no emotional component, but it is at the social interaction level, conversation, meeting of minds, whatever. You don't fall in love with an escort on the first meeting and if you did, then there are deeper issues at work here other than should married people see escorts.

You seem to be harboring an incredibly confrontational tone towards me?

Perhaps you are still resentful regarding our dissenting opinions in the first thread that I started here at Lyla. If you intend to try and make this personal, I have to give fair warning that I don't take any debate seriously enough to let it effect my view of the person behind the words.

Moving on to your view of escorts. Just because you choose to run your business with a large degree of detachment from clients, does not mean everyone chooses to do so. I have met with some escorts who are perfectly fine to let a friendship develop as well as a degree of emotional intimacy.

Other escorts I have met with are right to the point, very disconnected, choosing to maintain emotional distance at all costs. I respect their right to do so but I tend to only visit with these individuals once.

Again I will say that polyamory has become a rather all encompassing term. I do agree that the word implies "multiple loves", but it's application blurs the line between love and physical intimacy.

You are speaking in absolutes, which unfortunately doesn't often reflect reality. Many different people see escorts for myriad different reasons, and the relationships that develop are not dictated by some sort of escorting rulebook.

In the end it really boils down to the same point I made in the bad domination thread. It's my money, and I want what I want, if a particular escort can't at least play the role of an emotionally connected person, then I'll just take my $ elsewhere, no harm no foul ;)

Somehow cuddling and chatting doesn't really add up if she is actually a domme.

 

perhaps another interested amatuer, so i wouldn't get my hopes up if i were you. It sounds like another case of potential disappointment, especially if you still plan to be a submissive who is giving orders and directions? lol

 

contracts i believe are due to the client saying yes to things and then signing it so that later on, when there are marks, bruises and potential bleeding, he can't go back and say he didn't agree to those things that were done. i can't imagine agreeing to tie up and basically torture someone without getting the agreement in writing first?

I'm not sure what you mean? The girl I am seeing now is the polar opposite of the woman that I didn't get along with last time, which can only be a good thing as far as I'm concerned.

The cuddling and chatting is in preparation for a roleplay, building trust and establishing limits. Are you trying to say that someone can't be kind/caring outside of a roleplay, and dominant when the roleplay begins?

That sounds somewhat unhealthy to me, but then again there are people who are supposedly "happy" in 24/7 sub relationships, who am I to say whether or not they are just in a state of Stockholm syndrome.

I don't think I'll be doing anything extreme enough to require a contract at this time, but I'll keep it in mind.

Additional Comments:

What sort of 'verbal domination' were you looking for?

And did you say as much?

 

I've never heard such a term before.. usually when someone wants verbal domination- they want exactly what you got.

Verbal domination:

Providing commands/direction vocally.

Verbal humiliation:

Vocalized belittling remarks/comments.

Poking fun, calling names, etc.

Perhaps I didn't make the difference clear to her in the beginning, but I only had 5 minutes to do so and she maintained her exasperated tone during this time. I'm not particularly convinced that she was paying much attention to what I was saying before we started the roleplay, as she also missed several fun activities that I requested.

That doesn't really matter though, to anyone who may wish to argue with me on this topic, I'll make it perfectly clear in a way that leaves no room for argument:

I paid her for my desired experience. I politely stopped the scene only when it was necessary to explain to her (in a perfectly reasonable tone) that I did not desire a specific activity she was currently engaging in.

That should be the end of it, no room for discussion, no room for argument on her part. I know what I want from the roleplay, and I will not be told that I am being unreasonable, or that I should just "shut up and take it". My money, my rules, no exceptions (though I do of course respect the limits/boundaries of others).

/thread :)

Think I have found a new dom who seems to be a lot more emotionally connected. I made the decision to spend a half hour session with her just cuddling up together and discussing my ideal domination scenario.

I feel like it is going to work out a lot better this time, I haven't trusted a woman this much in quite some time.

Won't have an update for at least a few days, I need to order myself a nice collar and leash before the fun can begin :D

Well, there were some other points I wanted to address, but I'm too slow so I'll probably miss a couple for now.

1) Sex and intimacy is indeed an expectation in marriage, whether that is right or wrong is another debate, but I suppose if one spouse isn't holding up their end of the bargain they agreed to, then that can be considered justification for a null contract. Even though people may remain in marriages for the good of kids/finances, the marriage terms could technically be considered null and void and sex outside the marriage could then be justified.

2) Sex and intimacy are 2 different things as far as I am aware. Sex can be a way to express intimacy, or sex can just be sex without emotional context. I find it interesting that some people may see escorts looking for one, and some see escorts looking for the other, often depending upon the life circumstances of the client.

Personally I have tried to see escorts for intimacy/emotional connection (being a fairly introverted man having difficulty on dating sites/real life encounters), however I always hit a mental block with intimacy.

Specifically I end up questioning whether the intimacy is real because it is bought and paid for. I wouldn't pay someone to be my friend, so I have a tough time paying someone for intimacy/emotional connection rather than just funny business.

3) I think we might be taking the third topic a little too far, and still not really finding any answers. It's a topic that may very well be debated for many years or decades to come.

It's probably time to reel in the premise on this topic, so I want to address the fact that going without sex is not equal to being locked in an isolation cell ;)

Also, since we know that sex is not the same thing as intimacy, we can't really say that going without sex will drive someone insane.

If someone has plenty of healthy relationships in their life, and other forms of intimacy, and masturbates regularly, I would say they can be a sane and productive member of society.

I know this because I lived this way for 10 years as a virgin, and the only thing that was driving me to have sex was a curiosity about women. When I say "if women didn't exist", I don't mean if they were to suddenly disappear. What I am saying is if women never existed at all and yet I still had a "sex" drive, then it would really just be a masturbation drive. This gives some merit to the fact that some men isolate themselves from women in society and live a celibate life, they do not isolate themselves from human contact mind you.

I have to say this has certainly been an enlightening conversation for me, I tried to keep my personal bias out of it and it's probably a good thing I did, because the reality doesn't line up with my personal assumptions regarding marriage ;)

I think i've developed a compulsive thanking disorder since joining Lyla, "Need to give just one more thanks, I swear this is the last one :p"

celebacy is certainly *not* a 'natural' state.. not for any creature/mammal actually. And it is a long-proven medical fact that sex/sexual release is a 'need' and not always a 'want'.... the build-up of tension, stress et al... is physically/mentally, emotionally draining.. and with the release.. comes the euphoria and relaxation that is also a *need* in order to function properly.

There is a massive chemical release/change when one either has s3x or masturbates.. and acts as literally a 'reset button' for your whole being....that is helpful physically as well as an incredible amount of other things.... so even if there were no more women on the planet.. yes, my dear boy...<grin> you would in fact, become h0rny again.. and again......<grin>.. and again.. you'd just handle it differently hehe

 

As far as the priests.. yeah.. I have long been of the opinion that forcing someone into celibacy is yet another form of instilling guilt...(no offence of course)... because you are definitely going to fail.... no matter how you chose to deal with it... being human, it is almost impossible to go your entire life without any form of that sort of release.

.....even if you are not conscious of it... you actually *have* 0rgasmed in your sleep.. several times before the age of 10... again.. it's a form of release that is muchly needed. And when you think about all the things a body/mind/psych goes through from age 0 to 10.. hehe it's no wonder we need some help lol

 

Although not many mammals have s3x purely for the sake of enjoyment.... as it is largely for procreation.. it will always be a 'need' in some form or another.

 

Quite frankly, I myself go sort of batsh1t crazy if I go a few days with no sort of release. If a person can't sleep, or is feeling particularly stressed/tense... chances are, a little 'solo time' can relieve that... as can a lovely session with a parrrtner <wink> hehe whether 'married' or not ;)

 

... 'marriage' to me, has been turned into something so commercial (much like almost everything else unfortunately..*sigh*....) I have never required a piece of paper to validate a relationship.... and still find it humorous/sad that *one* religion made that soooo important.. when, if they were to *actually* read the bible...(old testament) it says (and I cannot recall the chapter/verse)

"...and he took her into his cave.. and made her his wife"....

hehe wonder what they were doing in there? signing legally-binding marriage documents...? playing a rousing game of Parcheesi perrrrhaps...? naaah.. they were having seeeex! ;)

Yes, I'm aware of nocturnal emissions/wet dreams, but doesn't that sort of go against what you are saying? It's an indication that if you don't have sex for a period of time, your body will naturally take action, and relieve the buildup. One could also argue that masturbation would take care of this as well, as you say.

So while we do have sexual needs, we don't necessarily need to have sex.

However, sex does release chemicals in the brain that masturbation does not, it is said that sex provides greater long term satisfaction vs masturbation, I'm incredibly intoxicated right now, otherwise I would post links to back up my statements (a task for tommmmmorrrrrrow, he drunkenly slurred :D)

Additional Comments:

Yeah, I've had way to much to drink tonight for sure, so many good posts here, I'll get back to all of you once I sleep this off, sweet dreams everybody ;)

http://halifax.backpage.com/FemaleEscorts/ashley-new-number-new-location-rates-140-180-100-9028770468-dtwn-dartmouth-king-street/2579188

Additional Comments:

Well, I have. Wonderful girl, very open and caring.

All we did was talk and cuddle this time, but I do hope to enjoy her dom experience in the near future.

I don't justify it, I believe it's wrong and that it will hurt my spouse immensely if she finds out. I do it because, although I love my wife and want to spend the rest of my life with her, we are no longer compatible in bed. After 20 years of marriage she no longer needs it in her life. I, on the other hand need it regularly still. I tried going solo for a few years but it was not satisfying so eventually had to decide between an affair or a SP. With a SP, there was no commitment and not emotional. That was about 11-12 years ago and we still have a happy marriage, it's not perfect in the traditional sense but so far it's worked for me.

But is it wrong ...I go by the premise that there is the reasonable expectation that a marriage involves sex. If a person is not getting sex at home then seeing an escort is probably a very valid way of having sex. No commitment, no emotions but sexual satisfaction. I think that is better than become frustrated and resentful of a spouse for no longer having the same level of needs.

We may never really know? To answer that, we would first need to figure out if sex actually is a need. As a man, I can confirm that sometimes it feels like a need, but I wouldn't die without it, particularly as there are other forms of release.

There are many men who report a complete loss of desire after suppressing their sex drive for a certain period of time. It's never gone for good though, there are various things that can trigger a return of libido.

If there were no women in the world I'd never be horny again (hope that's not as ominous as it sounds ;) )

My view is pretty simple if one is partnered whether married or not and their partner is unaware of them frequenting SP's it's cheating plain and simple and there is no justification.

 

I am and I do and there is no way I can or could justify it nor would I try to..... it is what it is.

 

Peace

MG

Well, I'd say "at least your honest", but I'm not really sure that "don't ask don't tell can be excluded from the definition of dishonesty :p

I'm with Mr. Green on this. I don't justify my behavior nor do I ask my wife, whom I love, to explain our complete lack of intimacy.

May I ask how you know that you love your wife? If she is never intimate with you, and you feel the need to hide your activities from her. What does loving your wife mean to you? That might seem like a mean spirited question, but it's an honest one all the same ;)

Without dialogue how can there ever be intamacy?

That was sort of my line of thinking as well. Honesty and communication is intimacy in my book. Sex isn't really intimacy, though combining the two provides a wonderful result :)

So much good stuff here, I'm going to try and address things in one post.

FunElement:

It sounds like you have found a wonderful balance in your relationship, it isn't always clear going into a marriage that the same sex with the same person may get boring after a time, and it can have a negative effect on other aspects of a relationship.

I've conveniently forgotten the fact that sex is indeed somewhat of an expectation in marriage within many faiths. Of course I personally believe that it is unreasonable for it to be an "expectation", but I guess that's probably one of the many reasons why I haven't personally considered marriage.

Sometimes men might not be doing their fair share, but sometimes people just lose interest in sex, particularly if there isn't any variety to it.

Steve Mcqueen:

This somewhat falls under the "young and naive" category.

I agree with you completely. There are expectations on both sides when entering a marriage, and as time goes on some of those expectations may seem unreasonable.

I don't see anything wrong with what you are doing, though it does sound like it creates some tension in your relationship, where you take the "don't ask don't tell" route to protect her emotionally.

I do wonder if you had this knowledge going in? Did you take marriage and vows seriously at the time, or was it more for the enjoyment of the experience? As I mentioned previously, it is fairly easy for someone like me to have a clear understanding of what marriage "demands" via a quick internet search, it may not have been so clear cut when such tools were not available.

CapitalC:

The word polyamory certainly does cast a wide net. It conjures up imagery of romantic love, but it seems to have become a catch all term for any non-monogamous intimate relationship.

I say to each their own as well. Though as I dig deeper into this topic, it becomes clear that it is more about the emotional attachment than the sex. This brings up more questions, now I'm trying to figure out why we are fine with poly-friendships but not okay with sharing deeper emotional attachments with more than one person. Though I know there is a difference between romantic love and friendship, perhaps only personal experience will help to truly understand where the line is drawn :)

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I have the attention span of a gnat and quite frankly just quickly gazed at the responses. My two cents....if we could all just accept that sex is sex and love is love we would all be a lot happier! To me' date=' if an emotional attachment is created, then it's cheating. Purely physical encounters mean nothing in the grand scheme of things![/quote']

 

Perhaps we would be a lot happier, unfortunately everyone seems to have a different idea of where the line is drawn between love and lust.

:icon_razz: I've fallen into that age old trap, posting my age when trying to start a discussion.

Yes, I understand that life experience does exist, but I would appreciate if we can not assume that I don't know certain things and dismiss my thoughts out of hand.

I'm sure there is much that I don't know, and I'm always interested in learning more, that's why I started this discussion after all.

I do understand that love and sex are 2 different things, I've sidestepped university in favor of IT technical certifications, and I understand that people change.

I'm just trying to dig a little deeper here.

While I understand that people change and needs change, do others my age not understand this? Is this why there are so many failed marriages, affairs, escort visits etc? Why agree to a clearly defined set of rules if you have an understanding that you may not be the same person many years down the line?

Or perhaps there is justification for infidelity in marriage, perhaps seeing escorts isn't infidelity at all?

Please understand that I start a discussion of this sort to learn more. Respectfully, pointing out my age and suggesting that I just need to walk another 20 or so years to learn life's lessons the good ol' hard way isn't really helping me to be less young and naive :)

There are some young people who have amassed an incredible amount of knowledge in life, and some older people who can barely tie their own shoes. Age is a factor in life experience, but some people are perfectly capable of learning life's lessons at a faster pace. We also can't ignore the progress of technology and the internet. There is an unprecedented amount of information available to younger generations that wasn't available not to long ago. It may not be a substitute for life experience, but I like to believe it is supplemental. I remember a time not to long ago in my childhood wherein if I had a question, the only source of knowledge I had was mom or dad :)

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I'm single so I can't help to justify seeing an SP in marriage, I have no regrets being single and spending my time with an SP or MA. I certainly do love those times!

 

But I do have to ask the OP why he specifically references Christian marriages; do non-Christian marriages not matter when justifying an encounter with an SP or MA?

Fair enough. I take an interest in Christian marriages specifically because the Christian faith isn't very accepting of polyamory. This doesn't mean that I look down on the practice personally. It wouldn't make much sense to ask how people justify seeing escorts in a marriage if their particular faith has no qualms about the practice.

I'm sure there are other faiths that also take issue with polyamory, but I am unfortunately only familiar with my own personal religious indoctrination ;)

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In my case it's a bit different than others on this board. I'm a woman seeing a female escort. I discovered in my 40s that I wanted to experience being with a woman. I have no desire to be in love with a woman but I wanted to experience sex with a woman. I've been with my husband for almost 30 years and I'm still very much in love with him but obviously he wasn't able to satisfy the curiosity I had to be with a woman!

 

I tell him every time I go visit her. He is very happy that I'm fulfilling this need I have in a way that is not threatening to our relationship. He also very much enjoys when I tell him all the details after!

 

Obviously every relationship is unique but what I do know is that every relationship is work. Work and family pressure, kids, aging parents. It all adds up. I'm pretty sure that many relationships have been saved by a man visiting an escort. Spouses can certainly remain in love and care very much for each other but have different views on the frequency or type of sex they want to have. In my view seeing an escort is better for the relationship than having an affair where emotions can develop, jealousy can cause problems. I'm not sure that the majority of women see it my way. At least not the women of my generation and older. Just my 2 cents!

That certainly is a unique situation. Is it mutual, does he also have desires fulfilled in this way? I know some couples find there is an imbalance in this sort of a setup, I don't want to pry, but if your okay with talking more about it I'd be interested in learning more about how you've managed to maintain a balance.

On the topic of relationships saved by men visiting escorts, I think this might depend on the situation and whether the lines of communication are open. If a man sees an escort and his wife is in the know, then I certainly don't see an issue with it, although I would still wonder how they overcame the demands of their marriage vows, if polyamory wasn't a part of the deal.

Of course it is an entirely different story when the lines of communication are not open, when it is kept a secret, does this save the relationship, or perhaps it changes the nature of their relationship? Forfeiture of honesty and trust, might be a hefty price to pay for sexual release?

I do agree that escorts can be a much less demanding, more casual relationship, though there is always the possibility of emotions and jealousy developing. Humans are fallible of course, sometimes it goes beyond the business transaction, and it is a murky line between friendship and romantic love.

Taken to extremes masturbation can be unhealthy. If you go at it multiple times a day you can find yourself lacking energy, feeling depressed, losing sensitivity downstairs.

 

Speak for yourself. Multiple times can leave you happy, sleepy, dopey, and some of the other 3 Stooges, or Dwarfs...I can't remember...I feel too happy, sleepy, dopey...

Okay? As amusing as this is...are you saying that you personally are energized after masturbating? I'm not saying it's impossible, just not really inline with the reported side effects of habitual and excessive masturbation.

Perhaps the depression is situational, but the lack of energy seems to be nearly universal among men who report an addiction to masturbation.

Of course an addiction to masturbation often goes hand in hand with an addiction to pornography, so I'll admit that the depression might be more due to the pornography and content they are viewing rather than the act of masturbation itself.

Interesting, I have heard of bdsm contracts, I didn't realize they were in widespread use though.

In this particular case the domination is the same rate as regular service.

They do have a list of domination services offered, and they do ask for specifics of the encounter beforehand.

I have engaged in certain domination services with escorts in the past, never roleplay though. Some providers don't go into specifics of what they offer so I have found there is no harm in asking them if they might be into something, I never expect anything of them though.

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Also, seeing as I enjoy mixing domination services with "traditional" escort services, a pro dom wouldn't make much sense for me personally.

Well I am very much on the kinkier side, and here's what I understand:

People fall in love, and want to spend the rest of their lives with each other.

The traditional thing to do is to get married, so due to societal pressure, or symbolism, or whatever other reasons, people jump into a marriage, often without a full understanding of what marriage is.

I think open and honest relationships are just fine, nothing wrong with polyamory. I just find it intriguing that so few decide to shake things up, choosing to spend their time with someone without the symbolism/need for traditional marriage.

I also understand that people fall out of love, we never know how we will feel about someone down the line. The fact that so few fully understand the terms of christian marriage, both spiritually and legally, but are still willing to jump in and bind themselves to the legalities of marriage, seems to be a testament to the strength of societal pressure.

I guess that's another topic though.

Based on word of mouth among escorts, it would seem there are a lot of married people doing as you describe, keeping their time spent with escorts compartmentalized, rather than communicating the topic with their spouse.

One escort in particular, has even suggested that seeing an escort is not the same thing as infidelity, though she didn't explain her reasoning, so it could perhaps be a ploy to draw in a certain demographic of customers ;)

I'm a quick study, but I can't understand if I don't have much to go on. Curious to hear everyone's thoughts, whether you share your hobby with your spouse or not.

I'm going to keep this thread a little less confrontational than my last one, I'll refrain from being argumentative.

On the topic, I am not a married man. I am 23 years old and marriage has almost become a taboo for the modern culture.

There are so many other interesting things to do these days that I couldn't personally imagine tying myself down to one woman for the rest of my days.

I can see how it was a very tempting proposition in the past, particularly back when it was a pretty good deal for men.

The main topic here though is how do you married guys justify seeing escorts to yourselves? Marriage is of course a part of the christian faith, and has a certain set of rules to follow if you wish to adhere to that faith.

So it seems like seeing escorts could technically be infidelity?

Of course I can understand if some married guys view tying the knot as a naive mistake from their past, it could become very complicated to correct this mistake if you are 20-30 years into a loving, committed relationship and/or raising kids.

Happy to hear your thoughts, and I promise I will keep an open mind this time ;)

Yes, that's what I thought. I think at the very least I will make it clear to this person that I did not enjoy the experience. Perhaps it will be a wakeup call for them.

Not even going to try posting a review on Lyla, I know what happens to negative reviews here.

Some aspects were really enjoyable, I didn't expect to be doing a verbal roleplay at all, but it gave me an incredible rush to be referred to as "slave" during our initial contact, so I figured it was worth a shot. Little did I know what her idea of a slave is.

Maybe I will try again in the future, I know of a very popular provider in my area that offers domination, I've just been too cheap to go see her, and too lazy to go through her verification process :p

Evidently cheaper and easier isn't always better, and it would be better to get to know the provider in a regular session before trying domination. I now know that I really need to put a lot of trust in someone before I am able to submit to them and enjoy the experience.

Additional Comments:

Almost forgot something really important. It goes back to our discussion in the ask an escort thread about the stereotypical roles for doms and subs.

This girl was completely rigid, entirely set on the stereotypical angry dom performance.

She absolutely hated when I expressed any enjoyment of the roleplay as well.

I tried to explain to her that she can be controlling without playing the part of an emotionally void sociopath, but she just wasn't getting it, she couldn't understand how emotions don't make up the entirety of the domination roleplay. I think she really just wanted to see that fear in me all the time, and couldn't stand the thought that I might actually get some enjoyment from her control.