Is it wrong to ask a SP for verification?

[MsManda 25827]

2 hours ago, RobertDion said:

Again, the initial conversation he started has conveniently gone unanswered. Exactly how does it make an SP feel more safe by them having a copy of my driver's licence?

Imagine I go onto a gift shop, browse around, pick out an item, go up to the cashier, I have my debit card out and she asks me for a credit check.... "a credit check? I can pay cash, I have it right here". "Nope, I need to check your credit score before we can make this transaction, you know, in case you want to rob me, I'm protected" -- I fail to see the logic in this.

Again, I don't to see how collecting and keeping a hobbyist's personal info protects the SP from violence. I found drakonis17's question to be a bit ridiculous, because just like Ms Manda pointed out, no SP in their right mind would do such a thing, heck half the ads on LL state "will not provide any more photos"   ... but I was just pointing out therealsweetier's hypocrisy in her response. Don't kid yourself too much their Mikey, you'll out yourself. Because let's not forget; we're the ones not allowed to ask questions, we're the ones paying the cash, we're the ones having to verify our identity, we're the ones paying deposits, we're the ones going to their locations, we're not the ones setting the prices, they are (as it should be), perhaps your've been lucky and you haven't been screwed over Mikey, wether it's a reputable agency or independant or not... but I'll call the BS when I see it, make no mistake.

There's no need to score brownie points with your virtue-signalling by saying they're already at a disadvantage. Not when they keep stacking up the claims that they're wanting deposits, and IDs and references and all this under the reasons of 'personal safety' --so let's CALM down---- let's not dig ourselves into a deeper hole. Because it looks like people are taking advantage of the situation in my eyes.

Think io it - To what end will this go? Why not just ask for all the money up front? If what you're saying is true, and they are at such a severe disadvantage, then why not demand MORE safety and assurance?? Ask for twice as much and for all of it to be e-transfered up front? If all SPs did this, would we not have no choice but to comply? You know, for the safety and reassurance of everyone? To make it fair? Yes? Since the economics of this and supply-and-demand seem to be irrelevant.

Why not evolve all this to its next logical step?

Yeah? No?

I mean.. We don't have to ask for money up front lol 

Many great clients love to prepay, and you never hear of us stealing their prepayments 👀

 

You're trying to pull a power play in a place where the providers are mostly verified 

 

This rant might be more suited for the craigslist crowd

[MikeyInHalifax 378]

1 hour ago, RobertDion said:

Again, the initial conversation he started has conveniently gone unanswered. Exactly how does it make an SP feel more safe by them having a copy of my driver's licence?

Imagine I go onto a gift shop, browse around, pick out an item, go up to the cashier, I have my debit card out and she asks me for a credit check.... "a credit check? I can pay cash, I have it right here". "Nope, I need to check your credit score before we can make this transaction, you know, in case you want to rob me, I'm protected" -- I fail to see the logic in this.

Again, I don't to see how collecting and keeping a hobbyist's personal info protects the SP from violence. I found drakonis17's question to be a bit ridiculous, because just like Ms Manda pointed out, no SP in their right mind would do such a thing, heck half the ads on LL state "will not provide any more photos"   ... but I was just pointing out therealsweetier's hypocrisy in her response. Don't kid yourself too much their Mikey, you'll out yourself. Because let's not forget; we're the ones not allowed to ask questions, we're the ones paying the cash, we're the ones having to verify our identity, we're the ones paying deposits, we're the ones going to their locations, we're not the ones setting the prices, they are (as it should be), perhaps your've been lucky and you haven't been screwed over Mikey, wether it's a reputable agency or independant or not... but I'll call the BS when I see it, make no mistake.

There's no need to score brownie points with your virtue-signalling by saying they're already at a disadvantage. Not when they keep stacking up the claims that they're wanting deposits, and IDs and references and all this under the reasons of 'personal safety' --so let's CALM down---- let's not dig ourselves into a deeper hole. Because it looks like people are taking advantage of the situation in my eyes.

Think io it - To what end will this go? Why not just ask for all the money up front? If what you're saying is true, and they are at such a severe disadvantage, then why not demand MORE safety and assurance?? Ask for twice as much and for all of it to be e-transfered up front? If all SPs did this, would we not have no choice but to comply? You know, for the safety and reassurance of everyone? To make it fair? Yes? Since the economics of this and supply-and-demand seem to be irrelevant.

Why not evolve all this to its next logical step?

Yeah? No?

I'm not kidding myself. You're right, I've never been scammed or robbed or fucked over by any SP that I've seen. Why? Because I take proper precautions. I check for reviews. I ask questions. I firmly believe that whatever happens to me is a result of my own actions.

 

I have never once sent a deposit, however if it was a lady that had reviews, website, social media presence, you know, A DISCERNABLE POSITIVE REPUTATION, I would have no issues going through a screening process if it was a girl that I really wanted to visit.

 

Ultimately these women are responsible for what happens to them. If that means they want to set their own requirements for seeing a gentleman, that's their business and if you don't like it you can seek entertainment elsewhere. 

 

To answer your hypothetical, if the ladies decided to make unreasonable requests, then I simply wouldn't see that woman. 

 

Here's the thing you're missing. You have a choice. You can choose to see a lady that requires a deposit, or not. You can choose to not screen and see a woman who doesn't ask for any of that. You. Can. Choose. I think the real issue is that you REALLY want to see all these wonderful ladies but just don't like the requirements.

 

To your comment about virtue signalling. I'm sorry if wanting everyone to be safe and comfortable offends you. 

[RobertDion 142]

1 hour ago, MsManda said:

I mean.. We don't have to ask for money up front lol 

Many great clients love to prepay, and you never hear of us stealing their prepayments 👀

 

You're trying to pull a power play in a place where the providers are mostly verified 

 

This rant might be more suited for the craigslist crowd

Most SPs don't ask for money up front, but those that do, wouldn't that be the power play?

[RobertDion 142]

Doesn't offend me one bit. It's the double standards I called out in that case that was mentioned. I agree with most of what you say. I just find it funny that as soon as a hobbyist asked "hey is it unreasonable to ask for some sort of security/proof of the SP is real?...as they do with us?" And we all jump down his throat. I would rather the answers to "why do they ask for the client's ID?" have realistic and truthful answers. You know, a powerplay, let's call it for what it is, as Manda suggests. To simply say "we do this for our own protection" when it obviously does nothing of the sort is a bit disingenuous. The moment someone suggests some sort of 'hey, how come this is a thing?' and the person is told to accept it as how the process works here, it tends to bring up some dirt that was hidden before. 

Yeah, OK, sure, are we forgetting what we're all doing here? Not everything is centered around SPs being in this vicious fight for survival everyday, with how brutal things are ? as one SP suggested in this thread. It's ALL about power, lets' call this for what it is. To say otherwise is fear mongering and deceitful to what we're all trying to do here. Exchange funds for entertainment. 

[MsManda 25827]

11 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

Most SPs don't ask for money up front, but those that do, wouldn't that be the power play?

You're actually trying to compare the dynamics of maybe clients taking advantage of new sps naivety, to established providers who accept prepayment?

Because I don't know of anyone demanding full payment up front from strangers who haven't no showed 👀

 

It's not the same at all, and you know this 

 

You could just choose not to book those providers lol idk why this is so hard for you to understand

 

 

[MsManda 25827]

9 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

Doesn't offend me one bit. It's the double standards I called out in that case that was mentioned. I agree with most of what you say. I just find it funny that as soon as a hobbyist asked "hey is it unreasonable to ask for some sort of security/proof of the SP is real?...as they do with us?" And we all jump down his throat. I would rather the answers to "why do they ask for the client's ID?" have realistic and truthful answers. You know, a powerplay, let's call it for what it is, as Manda suggests. To simply say "we do this for our own protection" when it obviously does nothing of the sort is a bit disingenuous. The moment someone suggests some sort of 'hey, how come this is a thing?' and the person is told to accept it as how the process works here, it tends to bring up some dirt that was hidden before. 

Yeah, OK, sure, are we forgetting what we're all doing here? Not everything is centered around SPs being in this vicious fight for survival everyday, with how brutal things are ? as one SP suggested in this thread. It's ALL about power, lets' call this for what it is. To say otherwise is fear mongering and deceitful to what we're all trying to do here. Exchange funds for entertainment. 

Coming from the loudest fear mongerer here 🙄

 

It IS about power, you're completely right.. And also completely wrong 

 

If we reveal ALL of our safety practices and the why, on a public forum, y'all will find ways around them and further risk our lives, homes, and general safety 🙄

We do need to keep some mystical magic about us, for our own safety lol

This used to be commonly understood, back when lyla was cerb 

 

It's been elaborated here enough that any newb to the forum should get the idea, but if you're still lost, look up any ture crime doc on murdered sps, and see why we screen, if you don't want to believe our lived experiences while we're ALIVE to tell them 🙄

 

If you can't comprehend why women meeting strange men alone for naked endeavours might want those men to not be anonymous, then this clearly isn't the hobby for you 🤷

[MikeyInHalifax 378]

4 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

Doesn't offend me one bit. It's the double standards I called out in that case that was mentioned. I agree with most of what you say. I just find it funny that as soon as a hobbyist asked "hey is it unreasonable to ask for some sort of security/proof of the SP is real?...as they do with us?" And we all jump down his throat. I would rather the answers to "why do they ask for the client's ID?" have realistic and truthful answers. You know, a powerplay, let's call it for what it is, as Manda suggests. To simply say "we do this for our own protection" when it obviously does nothing of the sort is a bit disingenuous. The moment someone suggests some sort of 'hey, how come this is a thing?' and the person is told to accept it as how the process works here, it tends to bring up some dirt that was hidden before. 

Yeah, OK, sure, are we forgetting what we're all doing here? Not everything is centered around SPs being in this vicious fight for survival everyday, with how brutal things are ? as one SP suggested in this thread. It's ALL about power, lets' call this for what it is. To say otherwise is fear mongering and deceitful to what we're all trying to do here. Exchange funds for entertainment. 

I certainly didn't jump down anyone's throat. I simply posited that there are many SP's that have lots of reviews, social media presence, and have clear instructions on how to go about setting up a date. The onus is on YOU the buyer to do your due diligence. If that means that YOU want to ask for verification, so be it.

 

At the same time, the SP can refuse to abide by that request, as has been so forcefully demonstrated in this thread. 

 

You are not wrong about the power dynamic. You may not like it, but the SP has total control of the service you are trying to secure. You may not agree with conditions they set for acquiring their services, but guess what, there's absolutely nothing you can do about it.

 

You suggest an ever escalating series of hoops that clients have to jump through to secure an SP's services. You know when that will cease? When assholes stop questioning why these ladies have to do what they do.

 

This must be the only industry where customers think they can go to market and try to tell the seller how to conduct their business, and simultaneously yell at them about the way they conduct their business.

 

 

[TommyRuss 4]

9 hours ago, Pamela Luscious said:

There's so many amazing gentlemen out there who screen and follow our booking process without questions. They read out ads and websites and do proper research, they never been scammed. They treat us good and have an amazing time during the date. Why waste our time with the one's who give us headache with just booking lol...

Can confirm those of us who follow the required booking process are treated to an amazing time!

[MsManda 25827]

3 minutes ago, MikeyInHalifax said:

 

 

This must be the only industry where customers think they can go to market and try to tell the seller how to conduct their business, and simultaneously yell at them about the way they conduct their business.

 

 

While still expecting us to want to show up and smile and suck their dick 😂

Like I love what I do but I wouldn't work any job under such conditions

 

[RobertDion 142]

No one's saying "we demand you reveal you're true identity" or anything. And I doubt the ever escalating amount of hoops would stop when people stop asking questions, otherwise we wouldn't be talking about this at all, would we. But if an SP is justifying a screening process out of this fear of being 'murdered' I'm not sure this hobby os for them.

And well put Manda, that's all true. It's just a shame the fear mongering needs to be implemented like this, good lord. There's a lot of over-thinking here 🙂

[RobertDion 142]

11 minutes ago, MsManda said:

While still expecting us to want to show up and smile and suck their dick 😂

Like I love what I do but I wouldn't work any job under such conditions

 

And yes, this is the only industry that has the person buying the services being put through this screening process like there's no tomorrow. It's backwards, but at least we can agree it's more of a powerplay, and far less of a "for our safety" excuse. Because other than the threat of giving out my ID to others, it does nothing to prevent the horrible acts mentioned earlier. Like first the analogy I stated, I just wanted to get the guy to build me my deck, why all these credit checks and proof of insurance? hahaha -- being paranoid of all these creeps and low lifes and violent people is giving the other 99% a bad reputation?

[MsManda 25827]

6 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

No one's saying "we demand you reveal you're true identity" or anything. And I doubt the ever escalating amount of hoops would stop when people stop asking questions, otherwise we wouldn't be talking about this at all, would we. But if an SP is justifying a screening process out of this fear of being 'murdered' I'm not sure this hobby os for them.

And well put Manda, that's all true. It's just a shame the fear mongering needs to be implemented like this, good lord. There's a lot of over-thinking here 🙂

The hoops were the same til someeee people decided they could just make 9272 new email addresses /phone numbers/new identities and do unsavory shit 

 

The ID verification became necessary because someeee people couldn't be trusted,. 

And while we can also get blackmailed etc like you, we also risk death, soooo

It's not like this isn't well documented with a simple Google search. 

 

Some sps now require IDs

And people try to mess with that, so yeah, maybe more changes have to come in the future lol that's your choice though 

 

Spread that around maybe, if you don't like how things are/where they might go? 

[MsManda 25827]

4 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

And the only industry that has the person buying the services being put through this screening process like there's no tomorrow. Like like first analogy stated, I just wanted to get the guy to build me my deck, why all these credit checks and proof of insurance? hahaha -- being paranoid of all these creeps and low lifes and violent people is giving the other 99% a bad reputation?

It's not 99% though, or we wouldn't need to screen 🙄

Le sigh

[MsManda 25827]

6 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

And yes, this is the only industry that has the person buying the services being put through this screening process like there's no tomorrow. It's backwards, but at least we can agree it's more of a powerplay, and far less if a "for our safety" excuse. Like first analogy I stated, I just wanted to get the guy to build me my deck, why all these credit checks and proof of insurance? hahaha -- being paranoid of all these creeps and low lifes and violent people is giving the other 99% a bad reputation?

We do not agree

I'm not building you a deck. 

Or sucking your dick, for that matter

 

No matter how you twist my words 😂

Thank youuuu, screening 🙏

[RobertDion 142]

11 minutes ago, MsManda said:

The hoops were the same til someeee people decided they could just make 9272 new email addresses /phone numbers/new identities and do unsavory shit 

 

The ID verification became necessary because someeee people couldn't be trusted,. 

And while we can also get blackmailed etc like you, we also risk death, soooo

It's not like this isn't well documented with a simple Google search. 

 

Some sps now require IDs

And people try to mess with that, so yeah, maybe more changes have to come in the future lol that's your choice though 

 

Spread that around maybe, if you don't like how things are/where they might go? 

I wasn't aware.

[RobertDion 142]

7 minutes ago, MsManda said:

We do not agree

I'm not building you a deck. 

Or sucking your dick, for that matter

 

No matter how you twist my words 😂

Thank youuuu, screening 🙏

Awww, why not? Can you imagine? a deck builder that ALSO sucks your dick??

[RobertDion 142]

And you putting a client through screening wont' stop that client from doing the things you say you fear they'll do, so then all that's left is just doing it for power and control. And that sucks. hahah

[TommyRuss 4]

2 hours ago, MikeyInHalifax said:

Here's the thing you're missing. You have a choice. You can choose to see a lady that requires a deposit, or not. You can choose to not screen and see a woman who doesn't ask for any of that. You. Can. Choose. I think the real issue is that you REALLY want to see all these wonderful ladies but just don't like the requirements. 

100% true.  If you don't like the deposit requirement, or booking requirements, you can simply not comply and not see the lady and move on.  Everyone wins.

 

But to touch on the original question, given the number of legit looking scams out there, its understandable that a guy without much experience in this world would look for some extra assurance.  Its easy to see how a newcomer would have difficulty and would be questioning what's real and what's not. 

[MsManda 25827]

Just now, RobertDion said:

I wasn't aware.

 

1 minute ago, RobertDion said:

And you putting a client through screening wont' stop that client from doing the things you say you fear they'll do, so then all that's left is just doing it for power and control. And that sucks. hahah

Clearly 

 

 

 

because we're not supposed to let you peek behind the magic curtain, but at risk of spoiling the fantasy, we have reasons for our methods and I shouldn't have had to spell it out for you 🙄

 

 

I already told you that people stalk us, but the spammy behaviour made you finally get the picture? Ugh

 

It actually weeds out more bs than you'd think

 

With every restriction that you think is silly, there is a clear reason why it's been accepted as standard by independent sps. 

 

I used to book fake names and no phone numbers, but they couldn't all be trusted and it ruined it for everyone. 

 

Statistically, people just fuck around less  if you know who they are irl. That's well studied and documented across many situations, not just sw. 

In our situation, fucking around risks our health, security, and safety, so we just can't tolerate that

 

 

 

 

[MsManda 25827]

6 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

Awww, why not? Can you imagine? a deck builder that ALSO sucks your dick??

Try asking for that, like some people ask for the HE at a random registered massage therapist, and find out, and report back 😈

[Pamela Luscious 242]

23 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

But if an SP is justifying a screening process out of this fear of being 'murdered' I'm not sure this hobby os for them.

And well put Manda, that's all true. It's just a shame the fear mongering needs to be implemented like this, good lord. There's a lot of over-thinking here 🙂

 

22 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

And yes, this is the only industry that has the person buying the services being put through this screening process like there's no tomorrow. It's backwards, but at least we can agree it's more of a powerplay, and far less of a "for our safety" excuse. Because other than the threat of giving out my ID to others, it does nothing to prevent the horrible acts mentioned earlier. Like first the analogy I stated, I just wanted to get the guy to build me my deck, why all these credit checks and proof of insurance? hahaha -- being paranoid of all these creeps and low lifes and violent people is giving the other 99% a bad reputation?

How is this a double standard? We literally expose ourselves online every single day to prove legitimacy. Ads are verified, socials are linked, we post many photos, we collaborate with others. Our reputations are public and constantly scrutinized. You, on the other hand, are hiding behind a random phone number and nothing else.

 

You call it ‘fear mongering,’ but the truth is we are targeted. Escorts have been stalked, assaulted, and murdered by clients. That’s not overthinking, that’s fact. You asking me to just hand out selfies, my hotel room number, or my ID is reckless. I risk losing my safety, or worse. Those are not the same stakes.

 

And please stop comparing this to hiring a deck builder. No deck builder is meeting strangers behind closed doors in a stigmatized industry with their body on the line. Screening is not a power play. It’s a survival tool.

 

So yes, we screen. If that makes you uncomfortable, this hobby isn’t for you. White male privilege is assuming you can dismiss women’s safety because it doesn’t affect you personally.

[Pamela Luscious 242]

38 minutes ago, RobertDion said:

And you putting a client through screening wont' stop that client from doing the things you say you fear they'll do, so then all that's left is just doing it for power and control. And that sucks. hahah

Uhhh… yeah, that’s the whole point. Even with screening, we are still at risk, but obviously we’re going to do our best to protect ourselves.

 

So your alternative is what? Just agree to meet anyone with a fake number, no deposit, no screening? Okay…

 

So who’s coming to see me then? How many actually show up? How many send threats or waste my time? ‘No face, no case’.

[Pamela Luscious 242]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/murder-day-parole-eustachio-gallese-1.5439020

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/courtepatte-killer-also-guilty-of-prostitute-s-murder-1.1083335

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/serial-killer-robert-pickton-dead-1.7221260

 

[RobertDion 142]

1 hour ago, Pamela Luscious said:

 

How is this a double standard? We literally expose ourselves online every single day to prove legitimacy. Ads are verified, socials are linked, we post many photos, we collaborate with others. Our reputations are public and constantly scrutinized. You, on the other hand, are hiding behind a random phone number and nothing else.

 

You call it ‘fear mongering,’ but the truth is we are targeted. Escorts have been stalked, assaulted, and murdered by clients. That’s not overthinking, that’s fact. You asking me to just hand out selfies, my hotel room number, or my ID is reckless. I risk losing my safety, or worse. Those are not the same stakes.

 

And please stop comparing this to hiring a deck builder. No deck builder is meeting strangers behind closed doors in a stigmatized industry with their body on the line. Screening is not a power play. It’s a survival tool.

 

So yes, we screen. If that makes you uncomfortable, this hobby isn’t for you. White male privilege is assuming you can dismiss women’s safety because it doesn’t affect you personally.

Yes, but as the point was made; you're not seeing it from the other side. You're putting the cart before the horse in this respect. You can't play the victim and have it both ways too. Well, I suppose you CAN, but that's far from fair, or is the argument "yup, not fair for men, sucks to be you"? It's the hypocrisy of it all -- and the only answer is: "well this hobby isn't for you" --- Look, if YOU'RE the one claiming to put yourselves in harm's way, isn't that your choice? Yes, we'll never fully see it from your point of view, we're not you. The best we can do is imagine the strange, awkward, uncomfortable situations you find yourselves in all the time, we get it. But you're making things out like your clients are forcing you to do unfavourable things that you don't want to happen (and no, I'm not including meetings needing badly or violently or stalking or anything bad and negative like that), your ads go up, you literally place a value on yourselves, on your services, YOU do this, not us. And as many ads sometimes say "non-negotiable" and no one here is saying we want it to be.

So THIS is what becomes double-standards, do you see what happens to the GOOD and honest hobbyst who wants to todo the good thing and comply when he hands over his ID and that SP than uses that ID for something bad against that person? We are the ones finding the person we hope will give us the services we're looking for, correct? So what does that mean? Well, you're not using your real name, and if the hobbyst's intentions are BAD, will they use their own ID in order to pass through your screening process? No, he won't let's not pussyfoot around, let's not dance around what everyone wants to avoid as what this is. Cuckholding, hardcore BDSM/roleplay amongst two consenting adults aside, this is an exchange of funds for some pleasurable services.

"We could be preyed upon and stalked and other far worse things" Yes, we know this, but think about how one-sides you are making this, to preemptively do this process out of the fear of the worse thing to happen? Let's call this for what it is, we all know what's happening between two naked adults behind these closed doors as mentioned. So no more dancing around the subject. But like how gun laws does NOT stop the criminal who wants to get their hands on a weapon to murder someone, a screening process will not screen the bad individuals from the good ones. It places lots of personal information of that innocent hobbyist into the SP's hands. And all you have to say to me is "well, that's how it goes, that's the risk you take for being a hobbyist, sucks to be you". 

Asking for $50 deposit to secure a day and time is one thing, that makes sense, but to feel like its an inquisition where we have to go through hoops to get to the service/meeds we're looking for? When we ALL know that if the bad person wants to get through the screening process because of their ill intents they will NOT be using their real identity!! Put some thought into this scenario. WE are the ones seeking you out. Are YOU going on a website and combing through clients that you would like to hook up with? Reading their profile and info and then texting them and then setting up a date and time and wait for them to pay up and have them show up at your door? Nope, that's not how this works. Are you the one saving your money, waiting for your favorite SP to come to town? No.

All I'm saying is, its a shame that the bad experiences you've had, or perhaps not you, but the bad ones that friends or acquaintances of yours have had, makes it so you feel the need to do this process - and that is what you need to feel safe. In cold hard reality (sorry to break it to you) it will not keep you anymore safe than before, not even by 1%. For any SP who's had a potential client ghost them after you've asked them for there ID and/or references, you've probably thought to yourself "Ha, well, they weren't worth it anyways, I just sussed out a potential creep/stalker/nefarious person, mission accomplished".

I assure you, that maybe 1%, yes, but the other 99% were people like the rest of us, the majority of us who though to themselves "huh? why so I expose myself? so your friend or you yourself save that to use against me later, no thank you." and you lose out on what would have been a mutually friendly and beneficial meet up.

And I feel for you, I really do, for you or anyone that's had to go through any negative experience due to any creep or something out of the true crime novels/podcasts you read/hear, but it's just sad that we have to go through this. For two seconds - look at it from our point of view, there's plenty of willing vulnerability on our part in this back and forth we do as well. It's been illustrated in these forums on here and the DMs I've gotten about hobbyists getting screwed over, sometimes by highly reputable SPs as well, and yes I'm not just talking about low quality or bait-and-switch scenario, but as eluded earlier, the whole blackmail thing, as well, and yes, it's rare I'm sure in the grand scheme of things if we're to talk statistics in terms of the thousands of encounters happening daily/weekly, how many end up really badly for one or the other. Was it just last month some one on here said they almost got mugged by the pimp they didn't even know she had?

It does help when Manda mentioned the whole thing about "Statistically, people just fuck around less  if you know who they are irl. That's well studied and documented across many situations, not just sw. "

I hadn't thought of that in that way. It makes sense. And maybe it's paranoia on our part from seeing how governments or agencies sell you info online, how cell companies and health care companies just dump all your personal info online for the lowest bidder that makes it seem like an automatic red flag when your asked to send a photos of your driver's licence, spider-senses go off, and you think to yourself "why?"

But this whole thing of "well if you can't handle a screening process, maybe this hobby isn't for you" statements, is just a cop out, and avoiding the issue at hand. SPs protecting themselves from the scum that might be out there by having the other 99% (non-scumy hobbyists) be potentially treated like they're criminals (just in case) .... isn't exactly too progressive.

Assuming the worse... FIRST? And acting upon false assumptions... and these "what ifs"? is NOT painting your clients in a glowing light. NO hobbyist wants to enter an arrangement where he gets the sense that there's this underlying contempt or resentment happening towards them or this feeling that there's this subtle (or not-so-subtle) hatred towards men happening.

[RobertDion 142]

1 hour ago, Pamela Luscious said:

Uhhh… yeah, that’s the whole point. Even with screening, we are still at risk, but obviously we’re going to do our best to protect ourselves.

 

So your alternative is what? Just agree to meet anyone with a fake number, no deposit, no screening? Okay…

 

So who’s coming to see me then? How many actually show up? How many send threats or waste my time? ‘No face, no case’.

Well, that's it then, the alternative? Remember the time not long ago when there was no screenings? Even now, I'd say over 90% don't do screenings? It's not like it's this industry-wide standard. And i'm not saying "ahhh you suck cuz you ask for proof of ID" - not at all, I was just asking "sooooo how exactly does it make you safer?" Or it doesn't ?..... and it's just a habit for your peace of mind?

I'm just curious, what can we do to make things safer for you? What else can the non-threatening, non-violent, legitimately friendly, respectful and kind hobbyists do.... to keep you safe from the scum out there.

Sorry, that sounds sarcastic or condescending, it's not meant to, because really, truthfully--- How can the honest and non-harmful hobbyist protect you from the shitty ones that do the extremes as shown in your links?

If you admit you're still at risk, then aren't you exposing yourself to that double-satndard? Choosing to punish the innocent for the crimes of the crappy scumbags that intend to so you harm?

That makes sense to you, does it? Put the honest and respectuful hobbyist through the hoops and the maze to suss out those shitty ones?