HST Rant

[777flyer 1612]

This tax helps people in the lower income bracket....

 

Anyone who earns between $80K-$160K will receive $1,000.00, over 3 instalments......thats it..

 

We will pay more for most things........

 

Once again, our Gov't stuffs us with a tax increase.......

[Guest S***e]

The bottom line for me is I will have less disposable income at the end of the day. The HST and Ontario's new Eco tax effective July 1st have a negative impact upon me personally in addition to chronic municpal property tax increases thanks to property reassessments and the city of Ottawa's failure to live within a reasonable budget. Given the fact that we are bearly out of the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression the increased and added taxes will have consumers spending less and will likely encourage more activity in the underground economy. The governments of Ontario and the city of Ottawa are not doing us any favours in my view.

[PistolPete 61421]

The bottom line for me is I will have less disposable income at the end of the day. The HST and Ontario's new Eco tax effective July 1st have a negative impact upon me personally in addition to chronic municpal property tax increases thanks to property reassessments and the city of Ottawa's failure to live within a reasonable budget. Given the fact that we are bearly out of the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression the increased and added taxes will have consumers spending less and will likely encourage more activity in the underground economy. The governments of Ontario and the city of Ottawa are not doing us any favours in my view.

 

Yes just got my municipal property taxes as well, the next four installments have increased $80 plus dollars because of the "Tax" increase. My property taxes will go up for 2011 as documented in my bill. They already have the set amount for pre-authorized automatic withdrawals, but I'm sure next year the fuckers will raise it again.

[Parker 19761]

You might be behind it, but you can't blame the people who are trying to get by and are now having more money taken by the government for getting upset about it.

 

My cousins live in 'low-income households'... Between this HST and the slow jump in minimum wage, they are having problems affording everything they need.

 

I think some people, especially in government, forget that when minimum wage goes up or expected costs from a new tax, the low income people feel it first with cost increases.

 

I've been in Canada for a few years now, since I've come simple things like milk and bread have gone up quite a bit.

 

(Which was 8$ last night by the way, 5$ for the milk, 3$ for the bread... How do we expect lower income people to get by or move up making them pay almost 10$ for milk and toast?!?)

 

 

 

 

 

 

Read this, understand the personal tax cuts and the new benefits for low income people and then please explain how it's a tax grab.

 

http://www.rev.gov.on.ca/en/taxchange/families.html

 

It's funny how nobody rants when there's a tax cut but when government changes the way we are taxed everyone gets upset even if they don't understand the big picture.

[Guest S***e]

I'm in the same position as you are Pistol Pete and I am on monthly pre-authorized payments....yes, an increase for me as well heading toward $5K per year....yikes!

 

s

 

Yes just got my municipal property taxes as well, the next four installments have increased $80 plus dollars because of the "Tax" increase. My property taxes will go up for 2011 as documented in my bill. They already have the set amount for pre-authorized automatic withdrawals, but I'm sure next year the fuckers will raise it again.

[D-Blue 224]

So the 8% pst I no longer have to pay now becomes part of the 13% hst.Is that saving me money? Well maybe I'm not understanding the HST. All I know is I didn't have to charge my customers PST on my services only on the goods I purchase and 5% GST for the service and now I have to collect 13% for everything. How's that saving anyone money? Taxes and saving money don't even belong in the same sentence. Please correct me if I'm wrong as I havn't sent out any invoices this month and all I got from the government is a little pamflet telling me how wonderful the hst is and that I can send it to the same place I sent their gst.

 

In your business it is saving you money. When you last bought a PC or equipment or furniture or supplies you paid the 8% PST but claimed the 5% GST as an input tax credit. Now you will be claiming the full 13% as a credit so you save 8%. Any of your customers who are HST registered businesses will not see any increase. Many businesses had to administer two sales taxes and now it's only one so they save on that too.

 

The people that pay are the final consumers who are not HST registered and that is why we get the Ontario income tax reduction or the credits for low income families.

 

We just attended one of the HST seminars provided by Canada Revenue Agency and finally understood what it was all about.

 

Dalton & Steven

 

(so now you know where d-blue comes from, d for Dalton and 'blue' for the Conservatives)

 

Additional Comments:

You might be behind it, but you can't blame the people who are trying to get by and are now having more money taken by the government for getting upset about it.

 

My cousins live in 'low-income households'... Between this HST and the slow jump in minimum wage, they are having problems affording everything they need.

 

I think some people, especially in government, forget that when minimum wage goes up or expected costs from a new tax, the low income people feel it first with cost increases.

 

I've been in Canada for a few years now, since I've come simple things like milk and bread have gone up quite a bit.

 

(Which was 8$ last night by the way, 5$ for the milk, 3$ for the bread... How do we expect lower income people to get by or move up making them pay almost 10$ for milk and toast?!?)

 

I'm behind it because it is good for business and anything that is good for business helps create jobs. More jobs mean fewer unemployed which means less government support which means lower taxes for me.

 

I don't blame anyone for being upset about it but I am frustrated by people that rant because they don't understand the big picture. There are going to be a few people who lose out in the short-term but I believe that the HST (instead of GST and PST) is good for the economy and that eventually makes things better for all of us.

 

Minimum wage was very low for years but it has increased significantly in the last 6 years, from $6.85 in 2004 to $10.25 in 2010. 50% is not a slow increase and it's way more than any increase in wages for the rest of us! To use your example bread and milk prices have not increased that much in that time and I never pay the prices you quoted so I'm wondering where your cousins shop. In SW Ontario we don't need to pay more than $4 for a bag of milk and $2 for a loaf of bread. Those that shop at a variety store, or high-end grocery stores like Loblaws or Fortinos will pay more.

 

It's time I stopped posting in this thread, I'm starting to sound more like a politician than a pervert :-D

[Lowdark 5613]

If the tax is good, why were they so dishonest about it? I mentioned that the goverment originally maintained that it would be revenue neutral until there bluff was called and they "admitted" that it would cost the average family 300 to 600 hundred dollars more. So, why the deception? It his everyone where it hurts the most, gasoline, electricity, and heating (plus other consumable items).

 

This is not the only way this government has plundered the tax base lately. Anyone who has purchased major electronics lately has noticed that there is a "tax" specific to electronics for environmental handling. But they add it as a levy so that it appears as a purchase and therefore is taxed as well. It was introduced April 1, 2009 and this past April they expanded it to be charged on more items and increaded it on many others (that new TV you've always had your eye on will now cost you an extra 30 bucks without any additional quality). But no one knows where that money goes. The government is not offering any additional services for it as consumers are still responsible for transporting said electronics to select depots. And on that particular subject, when did a government that has insited it could never afford scrubbers for coal fired nuclear power plants (but could waste a billion dollars on a failed attempt to make health records digitzed) become so concerned about the enironment?

 

The HST is shifting taxes from businesses to consumers and the government has their fingers crossed that it will translate into more jobs. But as previous posts have metioned, this will mean less disposable money in everyone's pockets and it could increase the underground economy, so there is less tax. And those other income tax reductions will quickly be eaten up by other tax increases. Again, as some posters have mentioned, like their property taxes. This was poorly thought out and is being poorly managed (only nine days in as well). And if you are of the school of thought that this is a good thing, that presumes that you trust the government to manage it well. Refer to my initial point about their honesty.

 

Additional Comments:

If the tax is good, why were they so dishonest about it? I mentioned that the goverment originally maintained that it would be revenue neutral until there bluff was called and they "admitted" that it would cost the average family 300 to 600 hundred dollars more. So, why the deception? It his everyone where it hurts the most, gasoline, electricity, and heating (plus other consumable items).

 

This is not the only way this government has plundered the tax base lately. Anyone who has purchased major electronics lately has noticed that there is a "tax" specific to electronics for environmental handling. But they add it as a levy so that it appears as a purchase and therefore is taxed as well. It was introduced April 1, 2009 and this past April they expanded it to be charged on more items and increaded it on many others (that new TV you've always had your eye on will now cost you an extra 30 bucks without any additional quality). But no one knows where that money goes. The government is not offering any additional services for it as consumers are still responsible for transporting said electronics to select depots. And on that particular subject, when did a government that has insited it could never afford scrubbers for coal fired nuclear power plants (but could waste a billion dollars on a failed attempt to make health records digitzed) become so concerned about the enironment?

 

The HST is shifting taxes from businesses to consumers and the government has their fingers crossed that it will translate into more jobs. But as previous posts have metioned, this will mean less disposable money in everyone's pockets and it could increase the underground economy, so there is less tax. And those other income tax reductions will quickly be eaten up by other tax increases. Again, as some posters have mentioned, like their property taxes. This was poorly thought out and is being poorly managed (only nine days in as well). And if you are of the school of thought that this is a good thing, that presumes that you trust the government to manage it well. Refer to my initial point about their honesty.

 

Additional Comments:

Sorry everyone. I hit the same buton twice and doubled my bitterness. I promise to be good.

[bucken 1479]

Living on the Quebec side, all I can say it is the first time that I have seen the gas prices lower in Quebec than in Ottawa. Doesn't mean it is cheaper, just cheaper than Ottawa

 

:(

[PistolPete 61421]

I'm in the same position as you are Pistol Pete and I am on monthly pre-authorized payments....yes, an increase for me as well heading toward $5K per year....yikes!

 

s

 

Yup 5 k a year for what?..and Mr.O'Brien promised no tax increase... < insert middle finger to the Mayor > AND we are still behind the times in light rail, nothing accomplished,Bus strike..oh but lets raise the fares! Landsdowne grief, and now we have 12 to pick from for Mayor election in fall??When is Ottawa ever going to get with the times??

 

Sorry the thread was about HST,just a little pissed off!:ablow:

[pjrd 324]

In your business it is saving you money. When you last bought a PC or equipment or furniture or supplies you paid the 8% PST but claimed the 5% GST as an input tax credit. Now you will be claiming the full 13% as a credit so you save 8%. Any of your customers who are HST registered businesses will not see any increase. Many businesses had to administer two sales taxes and now it's only one so they save on that too.

 

The people that pay are the final consumers who are not HST registered and that is why we get the Ontario income tax reduction or the credits for low income families.

 

We just attended one of the HST seminars provided by Canada Revenue Agency and finally understood what it was all about.

 

Dalton & Steven

 

(so now you know where d-blue comes from, d for Dalton and 'blue' for the Conservatives)

 

Additional Comments:

 

 

I'm behind it because it is good for business and anything that is good for business helps create jobs. More jobs mean fewer unemployed which means less government support which means lower taxes for me.

 

I don't blame anyone for being upset about it but I am frustrated by people that rant because they don't understand the big picture. There are going to be a few people who lose out in the short-term but I believe that the HST (instead of GST and PST) is good for the economy and that eventually makes things better for all of us.

 

Minimum wage was very low for years but it has increased significantly in the last 6 years, from $6.85 in 2004 to $10.25 in 2010. 50% is not a slow increase and it's way more than any increase in wages for the rest of us! To use your example bread and milk prices have not increased that much in that time and I never pay the prices you quoted so I'm wondering where your cousins shop. In SW Ontario we don't need to pay more than $4 for a bag of milk and $2 for a loaf of bread. Those that shop at a variety store, or high-end grocery stores like Loblaws or Fortinos will pay more.

 

It's time I stopped posting in this thread, I'm starting to sound more like a politician than a pervert :-D

Boy, they saw you coming... My customers are not low income and ultimately have to pay the 13% on everything I buy for them and now on the service I provide which is now extra cost to them. Telling me I'm going to save 8% on my next computer is ridiculous when I spend much more on gas and utilities. It's a tax grab.

I'm done posting in this thread also.

[Parker 19761]

Minimum wage was very low for years but it has increased significantly in the last 6 years, from $6.85 in 2004 to $10.25 in 2010. 50% is not a slow increase and it's way more than any increase in wages for the rest of us! To use your example bread and milk prices have not increased that much in that time and I never pay the prices you quoted so I'm wondering where your cousins shop. In SW Ontario we don't need to pay more than $4 for a bag of milk and $2 for a loaf of bread. Those that shop at a variety store, or high-end grocery stores like Loblaws or Fortinos will pay more.

 

It's time I stopped posting in this thread, I'm starting to sound more like a politician than a pervert :-D

 

Not to change the subject.. but,

 

Minimum wage is not supposed to be high.. it's not meant to be lived off of. You're not supposed to get a $6 an hour job and then stay at it and do nothing the rest of your life.. You're supposed to graduate high school, go to college and then get a real job.

 

I'd like to see where you're buying your milk.. I know here, I don't bother buying homogenized because I'm not paying the extra couple dollars. I just can't make sense of paying that much for milk... people buy it for their kids.. it comes from cows, which are everywhere..

I can't understand why it's more expensive than a couple boxes of coke.

 

Canada is an amazing country, don't get me wrong.. but the cost of living here is unbelievable.

 

I'd have to agree with Lowdark.. The way it was explained to me was a shift in taxes from the business to the consumer in an effort to bring down prices.. Which it has yet to do..

[Guest S***e]

I think we are all suffering under a system of tax abuse as we are regarded as a endless source of revenue PP. I don't mind paying the education portion of my property taxes even though I do not have children. I have a problem with the MPAC system and its method of calculating municpal property taxes in that one's home valuation has no bearing on the city services used by the person(s) living there. Because I live in a socalled more popular area of the city (Westboro) my modest home is valued higher than some other parts of the city and as such my taxes are higher. That coupled with what I view as outrageous spending habits by the city of Ottawa (staff and council) my taxes go up even further. O'Brien's campaign of zero property tax increases was what got him elected as best as I can tell, however when you have the remaining council as status quo left-overs from the Chiarelli years his promise was not going to come to fruition in a million years. So what have we got over the past four years in Ottawa: property tax increases above and beyond the rate of inflation; mismanagement at city hall; runaway spending; a 52 day transit strike with councillors running amok during it; nothing that even resembles improvements to rapid transit in Ottawa be it with light rail, heavy rail or better bus service; and ongoing rhetoric concerning the redevelopment of Lansdowne. I sincerely hope that come October, people get out and vote as municipal elections tend to have very low voter turn out which is a shame as municipal politics is that which affects us the most of the three levels of government. Now, if someone would like to pay the $200 registration fee for their Golden Retriever to run, I'd gladly give him or her my vote for mayor I have no confidence in any of the current candidates. I am equally unimpressed with the current Kitchissippi Ward councillor either. I wonder sometimes why there hasn't been a "tax revolt" by property tax paying home owners in Ottawa. Just my take on it all as I'm old, cranky and cynical. LOL Now we have the HST...gotta love McGuinty!

 

Yup 5 k a year for what?..and Mr.O'Brien promised no tax increase... < insert middle finger to the Mayor > AND we are still behind the times in light rail, nothing accomplished,Bus strike..oh but lets raise the fares! Landsdowne grief, and now we have 12 to pick from for Mayor election in fall??When is Ottawa ever going to get with the times??

 

Sorry the thread was about HST,just a little pissed off!:ablow:

[Guest S***e]

Latest example of tax abuse is this damned Eco-fee (tax) put on various non-perishable goods, cleaners, grass seed, medications/prescriptions, concrete etc. some of which has HST piled on top of it under Stewardship Ontario which is part of Ontario Waste Management which is part of the Government of Ontario. Gas is 3 cents per litre cheaper on the Quebec side as is beer and many of these items subject to this added tax.

 

Tax revolt in Ottawa and Ontario is a brewing!!!

[D-Blue 224]

Not to change the subject.. but,

 

Minimum wage is not supposed to be high.. it's not meant to be lived off of. You're not supposed to get a $6 an hour job and then stay at it and do nothing the rest of your life.. You're supposed to graduate high school, go to college and then get a real job.

 

I'd like to see where you're buying your milk.. I know here, I don't bother buying homogenized because I'm not paying the extra couple dollars. I just can't make sense of paying that much for milk... people buy it for their kids.. it comes from cows, which are everywhere..

I can't understand why it's more expensive than a couple boxes of coke.

 

Canada is an amazing country, don't get me wrong.. but the cost of living here is unbelievable.

 

I'd have to agree with Lowdark.. The way it was explained to me was a shift in taxes from the business to the consumer in an effort to bring down prices.. Which it has yet to do..

 

Where did I say minimum wage was high? Not everyone can go to college and not everyone can get a "real job". Minimum wage jobs are very real jobs but they have low wages because the business owners want better profits and because consumers are only prepared to pay a certain amount for goods and services. Would you pay $5 for a cup of coffee at Tim Horton's or $15 for a burger at McD's so that the employees can be paid $20/hr?

 

I buy milk at Food Basics, $4 a bag and I agree it is too expensive.

 

If you think the cost of living here is unbelievable go to Europe and see what they pay. People in the UK have a right to complain, their sales tax is being increased from 17.5% to 20% and gas is around $1.80 there. I've seen health care, education, policing, emergency services, defence, roads and transportation systems in other countries and I have no problem paying taxes here for the privilege of living in Canada.

 

Additional Comments:

Boy, they saw you coming... My customers are not low income and ultimately have to pay the 13% on everything I buy for them and now on the service I provide which is now extra cost to them. Telling me I'm going to save 8% on my next computer is ridiculous when I spend much more on gas and utilities. It's a tax grab.

I'm done posting in this thread also.

 

Everything you buy for them is going to cost you 8% less so if you don't pass that savings onto your customers you are just a gouging businessman and you'll be the one doing the grabbing!

 

Contractors are no longer paying the PST on things like furnaces, windows and kitchens and their installed price should be lower now than it was before July 1st.

 

Like many others you probably plan on keeping the 8% and blaming it all on the government!

[Lexy Grace 103696]

No matter what we have to suck it up and pay it.

[OrangeX 100]

Some of you people seem to really know stuff about this HST.

How does one qualify for the HST bribe chegue?

I ask because some people didn't get theirs and they didn't get a note saying why. Some wouldn't even know about this, but read it here. :-)

Does one have to have "earned" income?

[etasman2000 15994]

Does one have to have "earned" income?

 

iirc it depends on your declared income. it also has to be below a certain amount.

[Guest s******ecan****]

HST/GST/PST are all consumption taxes which are preferable to taxes on income and investment. Problem is that governments never adjust the income tax system to compensate. We were promised those reforms by the Mulroney government when the GST was first introduced but except for minor adjustments nothing was done.

 

The Harper gov't reduction of the GST was a bait and switch, again comprehensive reform of the income tax sstem should be the priority something along the idea of a flat tax.

 

Consumption taxes are regressive in nature in that low income people pay a disproportionate share of the tax (in terms of their spending) but the trade off is supposed to be a income tax system that provides tax free income for low income earners and low tax rates for middle income earners.

 

The introduction of these consumption taxes can represent a step forward in tax policy but only when we see real and meaningful reform of the income tax act. This ridiculous game of the government taking our income and then giving us back credits for certain behaviours (last year's homeowners renovation tax credit is one example that comes to mind) hides the true cost of government services and makes it harder for the voters to make rational decisions about public policy. Not to mention the fact that people now spend lots of $$$ on H&R block and tax return software (most of it uneccessary even with our current system).

 

As for government inefficiencies, there are certainly lots but we shouldn't kid ourselves that we can dramatically reduce spending by getting rid of waste. Most of our spending goes to our social programs which are pretty damn popular. Any government that has tried to reduce them finds out pretty quick that it can be a fatal move. We also have to remember that this level of spending and taxation is essentially a social contract between the haves and have nots in our society. We allow moderate wealth redistribution in exchange for relative social stability.

[mod 135639]

I believe if you have a combines household income over 40grand you do not qualify. yeah it's crap! I don't even get my bribe money!?

[OrangeX 100]

Thanks for the info, I have to say that sucks!

Also I don't know if I can post the link but there is an article in the WSJ available online now and for some future time period Titled "Public Pensions and Our Fiscal Future" by Arnold Schwarzenegger. Wonder if there are any openings for a PS worker there. :-) Not a question.

[ArmitageShanks 100]

Some of you people seem to really know stuff about this HST.

How does one qualify for the HST bribe chegue?

I ask because some people didn't get theirs and they didn't get a note saying why. Some wouldn't even know about this, but read it here. :-)

Does one have to have "earned" income?

 

Which 'pacify the minions' cheque are you referring to? If you have filed a 2009 tax return these links should give you all you need. The first 2 are for low income people. The third may be the 'bribe cheque' but if you are single with net income of over $82,000 or in a family with combined spouses' net income of over $166,000 you get nothing out of it.

 

GST/HST credit (introduced with GST)

 

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/bnfts/gsthst/fq_pymnts-eng.html

 

Ontario sales tax credit (new for August 2010)

 

http://www.rev.gov.on.ca/en/credit/stc/index.html

 

Ontario Sales Tax Transition Benefit (Jun and Dec cheques in 2010 and Jun 2011 cheque if 2010 return is filed)

 

http://www.rev.gov.on.ca/en/credit/sttb/index.html