a delicate question for SPs and hobbiests

[GoinDown 3669]

this is ONLY about making informed choices. Nothing less nothing more.

Q should hobbiests who enjoy the company of tgirls and those SPs who see them disclose the fact or is due diligence (read the threads and reviews) the way to go?

[Guest st*****ens**ors]

Disclose to whom? Here? What risk is there for a hobbyist behind an anonymous screen name in disclosing an interest? It isn't an interest I share but I can't imagine that there is some sort of detriment attached to such a disclosure here.

[capitalCforcougar 16766]

Have to agree with Stillopensdoors here.... as a provider that sees anyone and everyone...whether transgender, lesbian, bi, straight. couples... et al... with no judgement... I like the fact that this site.. aside from the anonymity of a username.. gives one the safety to be themselves... with no worry... so there shouldn't be in disclosing anything one feels comfortable disclosing...... whether it be a kink/fetish... personal ideal... it's all lovely here...

It may/not be something others share with you/your friend.. but rest assured, it will not be something anyone here would ridicule about..(yet another thing to go on the 'things I like about lyla' thread hehe)

 

and chances are very good.. there is a provider (or a few hehe)... who would be happy to facilitate... ;)

...disclose away! <grin>

[Meaghan McLeod 179664]

This discussion has happened many times. The reality is - if someone has gone through gender reassignment surgery, they are now in their right gender. Prior to the surgery, they were living in a body that was not theirs.

 

However, I have a real issue with those that choose to publicly disclose the birth gender of someone who has gone through a reassignment. It puts them at risk. I don't like that. If they have gone through the reassignment, and you are attracted to them - what is the issue?

 

If you are someone that has a real issue with this - ask in advance. If in doubt, move on.

 

I wish society was much more open to everyone. Whether they are gay, straight, bi, trans, cross over, kink whatever - let them be who they are.

 

The comments of "dude, you know she has a d i c k" or "Hell, look at that adams apple", or even the most popular - "her hands are man hands."

 

Some of my closest friends have features of male and female. They have never had reassignment surgery, not are they interested in it. However, they do cry a little when someone says something that is cruel. Not everyone is a Barbie Doll or a Ken Doll.

 

However, as a society, I wish everyone could truthfully disclose without fear of crime or assault.

[capitalCforcougar 16766]

This discussion has happened many times. The reality is - if someone has gone through gender reassignment surgery, they are now in their right gender. Prior to the surgery, they were living in a body that was not theirs.

 

However, I have a real issue with those that choose to publicly disclose the birth gender of someone who has gone through a reassignment. It puts them at risk. I don't like that. If they have gone through the reassignment, and you are attracted to them - what is the issue?

 

If you are someone that has a real issue with this - ask in advance. If in doubt, move on.

 

.....and again, am in full agreement.. things/people are what they are.. no crap.. no contest....

h3ll, if we all were what we once were.. we'd all still be in kindergarten ;)

 

but I believe what he was asking was if the person (hobbiest/client) who is *interested* in tgirls should disclose that... and yeah.. whatever floats your boat.. is whatever floats your boat.... nobody need worry about judgement in this purrrrticular arena ;)

[Meaghan McLeod 179664]

.....and again, am in full agreement.. things/people are what they are.. no crap.. no contest....

h3ll, if we all were what we once were.. we'd all still be in kindergarten ;)

 

but I believe what he was asking was if the person (hobbiest/client) who is *interested* in tgirls should disclose that... and yeah.. whatever floats your boat.. is whatever floats your boat.... nobody need worry about judgement in this purrrrticular arena ;)

 

Actually the question is "should a TGirl disclose her status?" It was an indirect question, but that is what the question is.

 

"What ever floats your boat is a direct" ... Um, sorry, but very dangerous. So many people want to explore this, but get taken down, so they won't ask.

 

I see it time and time again.

 

Again, if someone has gone through the reassignment surgery, she/he is now in their correct body.

 

We don't need to know their original birth gender. If you have an issue with this - ask. If you don't like the answer, don't post on the boards - it creates a safety issue.

[TorontoMelanieJolliet 4458]

this is ONLY about making informed choices. Nothing less nothing more.

Q should hobbiests who enjoy the company of tgirls and those SPs who see them disclose the fact or is due diligence (read the threads and reviews) the way to go?

 

That would have to mean that clients disclose to their sps. And I really can't see that happening. How could you possibly do due diligence? How would you find out if an sp saw a client who saw a tgirl? A client would have to disclose that to an sp, and the sp would have to disclose that to you. Kind of a major indiscretion. And impossible also as sometimes sps can't even be presented with a legit phone number to feel somewhat safe, nevermind a true history of every man she meets.

 

If you are concerned about your health only because of this specific connection that may have taken place, then you aren't concerned enough for your health to begin with. You should be concerned just because there are no guarantees in life. You can't rest on your laurels because you have one tiny bit of information that you think holds the key. If you only worry if a certain type of connection may have occurred, and everything else is ok, then you should re-think your decisions and actions. Maybe a different conclusion is suitable for you.

 

Your due diligence begins with your own decisions to protect yourself, and any partners you may have. Educate yourself and develop an honest relationship with your doctor. And an informed decision includes not having intimate knowledge of everybody you may encounter and taking it from there.

[Meaghan McLeod 179664]

That would have to mean that clients disclose to their sps. And I really can't see that happening. How could you possibly do due diligence? How would you find out if an sp saw a client who saw a tgirl? A client would have to disclose that to an sp, and the sp would have to disclose that to you. Kind of a major indiscretion. And impossible also as sometimes sps can't even be presented with a legit phone number to feel somewhat safe, nevermind a true history of every man she meets.

 

If you are concerned about your health only because of this specific connection that may have taken place, then you aren't concerned enough for your health to begin with. You should be concerned just because there are no guarantees in life. You can't rest on your laurels because you have one tiny bit of information that you think holds the key. If you only worry if a certain type of connection may have occurred, and everything else is ok, then you should re-think your decisions and actions. Maybe a different conclusion is suitable for you.

 

Your due diligence begins with your own decisions to protect yourself, and any partners you may have. Educate yourself and develop an honest relationship with your doctor. And an informed decision includes not having intimate knowledge of everybody you may encounter and taking it from there.

 

 

this is ONLY about making informed choices. Nothing less nothing more.

Q should hobbiests who enjoy the company of tgirls and those SPs who see them disclose the fact or is due diligence (read the threads and reviews) the way to go?

 

The question is not - should sp's that see Transgendered people disclose to hobbyists. The question is "should Transgendered disclose" their original birth sex to hobbyists.

 

Additional Comments:

These are recent posts:

 

I'm 99% sure that is "deleted".

May post as being a female, but was not born a female.

 

After further investigation, I believe you may be correct in saying it is "deleted". Think I will pass.

 

That is definitely "deleted". She tends to use certain words and phrases that give her away. IHowever, I believe she is post-op, so there would be no package.

 

I raised the issue of deceptive advertising by transgendered SPs in the General Discussion Forum a couple of months ago. I don't understand why "deleted and deleted" don't disclose their status, but many posters in that thread seemed to be OK with not disclosing.

 

I can't beleive that they don't disclose their gender or transgender. I have no problem with them and or people who are inclined to be interested in that. But it is not my thing. Why trick people who are not interested in you to show up. I would just leave. But others may become angry and violent so really they are encouraging an unsafe situation for themselves. I think this warrants more conversation. There are customers for them. Why not cater to that. Why try to trick people.

 

Thanks for the info Horndog and fresh. Being a homophobe, I just don't understand why they don't disclose the truth about their born sex organs.

 

I agree. Since we are going for different kinds of service. It will be a total turn off. Its not like we are meeting for social events.

 

 

And another thread:

 

 

http://www.lyla.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=235154&highlight=transgendered

[TorontoMelanieJolliet 4458]

I think OP needs to re-phrase the question, using proper punctuation. lol

 

I see we all get different meanings from the same words. It's turning into 'who's on first' here.

 

[Guest st*****ens**ors]

Agreed. The original question has two subjects connected to the same predicate, which makes it difficult to interpret. I read it one way, and Megan another (though I suspect her interpretation may be closer to the OP's intent)

 

I think OP needs to re-phrase the question, using proper punctuation. lol

 

I see we all get different meanings from the same words. It's turning into 'who's on first' here.

 

[conquistador 18487]

Prufrock, that was my interpretation as well.

[50 Shades Raven 31380]

this is ONLY about making informed choices. Nothing less nothing more.

Q should hobbiests who enjoy the company of tgirls and those SPs who see them disclose the fact or is due diligence (read the threads and reviews) the way to go?

 

I read this a few times to get the gist of what the OP is asking.

 

I wouldn't be disclosing anything to anyone (whether on this site or otherwise).

If a client chooses to visit a tgirl, ma or provider, that is their decision.

 

Choice is something we have on this site. Reading posts, ads, reviews and such give a person an insight as to those choices.

 

If the OP is asking if we as providers 'talk' to one another, then the answer can be yes.

We might be asked by a provider for a reference. But I can't see any provider stating 'oh that person saw abcxyz type of person' it's more along the lines of 'he has pets so take care if allergic', 'wonderful experience would definitely see again', 'we didn't seem to have a real connection but things went well', and so on and so forth.

 

The type of person that one chooses to see in this capacity, is purely choice.

 

I would never ask a client if they have been with transgender/lesbian/gay/straight/poly, quite frankly, it's none of my business. Same goes to a client asking me, none of their business.

 

It is a confusing question, I read two meanings into it, so I'm unsure of what the OP really is looking for in an answer, or opinion.

[Daisy Mae 2693]

A seperate comment of the OP's on TERB may offer some clarification in regards to specifically what he's asking, which, to my knowledge is whether or not people should disclose if they see T-girls because he believes it increases 'the risk'.

 

"in an obliquely related vien .. I would want to know about hobbiests who frequent tgirls.

This to my mind multiplies the risk way past my comfort level.

There's a guy on the Rosie board who self identifies. I wouldn't see anyone that he has seen. jmo"

[Guest st*****ens**ors]

Hmph. Well that's arrant nonsense then.

 

First, there is risk implicit in all sexual activity that involves a partner, even if you believe a relationship to be monogamous. You take prudent measures to minimize that risk. If you're entirely risk averse, you're on the wrong board.

 

Second, thinking that contact, directly or indirectly with a transsexual increases your risk depends on a lot of assumptions that have no basis in fact, unless you plan on abandoning your normal prudent measures. Someone you meet at a church social may have a bad history of forgetting protection and pose a greater risk to you than a provider of any gender who is scrupulous about protection, hygiene and testing.

 

Third, how could you ever think it appropriate to demand a full disclosure of someone's sexual history on a first meeting, provider or otherwise? Why on earth would you imagine they have some obligation to make such a disclosure??

 

Misunderstandings of both risk and entitlement are at play here.

[Brad 49548]

A seperate comment of the OP's on TERB may offer some clarification in regards to specifically what he's asking, which, to my knowledge is whether or not people should disclose if they see T-girls because he believes it increases 'the risk'.

 

"in an obliquely related vien .. I would want to know about hobbiests who frequent tgirls.

This to my mind multiplies the risk way past my comfort level.

There's a guy on the Rosie board who self identifies. I wouldn't see anyone that he has seen. jmo"

 

I also initially thought the OP was asking if hobbyists interested in seeing someone who is transgender should announce it was with the idea that doing so would help them connect with a person they'd like to see.

 

If it is indeed instead due to the idea that he wants to know who to avoid, because of some idea that those who have been with a transgender person are at greater risk...well, that is very unfortunate to put it lightly. The idea that you're at greater risk being with a transgender person plays into outdated stereotypes and a lack of knowledge.

[GoinDown 3669]

TGirl as I understand the early terminology to be .. Is a pre-gender- reassignment-surgery person who is a natural born male who still has a penis but otherwise has feminine features via breast implants or hormone transition therapy etc. Hope this helps the discussion but I'm not hopeful lol

[Guest st*****ens**ors]

TGirl as I understand the early terminology to be .. Is a pre-gender- reassignment-surgery person who is a natural born male who still has a penis but otherwise has feminine features via breast implants or hormone transition therapy etc. Hope this helps the discussion but I'm not hopeful lol

 

That really doesn't clarify your question. Are you asking then that,

 

a) pre-op transgender providers disclose their possession of male genitalia? I'm assuming most do, as it would be hard to conceal beyond a certain point in a meeting...

 

b) providers disclose whether they see pre-op transgender clients, or

 

c) clients disclose whether they are interested in seeing pre-op transgender providers? Or have done so?

[Mikeyboy 27113]

.. I would want to know about hobbiests who frequent tgirls.

This to my mind multiplies the risk way past my comfort level.

There's a guy on the Rosie board who self identifies. I wouldn't see anyone that he has seen. jmo[/i]"

 

Sounds to me like he's asking if we as hobbiests should be obligated to identify ourselves if we have seen tgirls. That way he can avoid any sp's we've been with. Sounds like a lot of presumption, misconception and prejudgement to me. Not to mention the fact that if knowing your partners full history is your idea of risk management, than you are in the wrong hobby. It isn't likely to happen here. Nor should it. Discresion is the cornerstone to the hobby.

[fortunateone 156618]

Sounds to me like he's asking if we as hobbiests should be obligated to identify ourselves if we have seen tgirls. That way he can avoid any sp's we've been with. Sounds like a lot of presumption, misconception and prejudgement to me. Not to mention the fact that if knowing your partners full history is your idea of risk management, than you are in the wrong hobby. It isn't likely to happen here. Nor should it. Discresion is the cornerstone to the hobby.

 

 

 

Originally i thought he was asking if others would get all judgy about a guy who writes a review about a transgender sp. Then the 2nd part i figured he was asking, if client (him) were to write a review, would it interfere with his chances to book appts with sps, because sps would think he shouldn't be seen. Which was confusing, because i wasn't sure why he would think sps would think being openminded enough to see a Tgirl would be a barrier to seeing them, we prefer to see openminded clients who aren't all judgey about us, someone who isn't all judgey about transgendered people would be a great person to get to know.

 

however, the comment from t erb gets me thinking that the OP is the judgey guy and he wants clients to review when they see TGs, pre or post op, so he can monitor what sps that guy sees, so he can then eliminate by association any sps who see any guys who see TGs?

 

cuz the 2nd post didn't clarify any of it for me so i'm going with this explanation for now lol

[capitalCforcougar 16766]

....this whole thing is...quite honestly...making my rather lovely and typically preoccupied brain...ache ;)

remembering...or however they figure on keeping track.. who has seen who.. and who has what between their legs.. who identifies as what... far too much work for an experience that is, first and forrrremost... supposed to be enjoyable...fun... *yikes*

 

....and, from another comment posted by same purrrrson... I am of the belief that yes, purrrrhaps he is in fact the 'judgy one'.... unfortunate.... but different strokes <grin>

[capitalCforcougar 16766]

Here is the initial post: (nothing cut/altered)....

 

"this is ONLY about making informed choices. Nothing less nothing more.

Q should hobbiests who enjoy the company of tgirls and those SPs who see them disclose the fact or is due diligence (read the threads and reviews) the way to go?"

 

so... going on the fact that it *says* should the HOBBIEST disclose an interest.... (pointing out here that no it does not ask for the SP/MP to disclose their original birth gender.. or even imply that)..... they were asking for a ridiculous thing.. for someone who in the past.. may have seen (or does see) a transgendered person.... which again.. is a silly venture.. and a ton of work...(trying to keep all that in one's head simply to avoid seeing that person(s) - soley out of an uneducated 'fear' of being at a higher risk.... <shaking head in disbelief>.... they are indeed in the wrong hobby hehe

 

and just to clarify.. with the comment regarding my 'whatever floats your boat' statement.. I put that because it seemed to me that this person was INTERESTED in seeing a Tgirl.. so I thought there would be no harm in them disclosing that... after all.. nothing essentially wrong with one's interests.... and by putting that out there... they may indeed attract the type of MP/S they are seeking... win win.... but the longer this gets dragged through the mud.. the sillier it gets.......

 

There was also a comment about one's brain and how it's wired... and they are dead on... although misguided in their statement... we are indeed wired a certain way.. male.. female.. but.....if by chance a person is wired female.. and in a male body.. or vis versa.. who are we to judge them for taking the steps to be afforded the opportunity to be comfortable in their own skin? ;)

 

simply put... we aren't....

 

....can we maybe talk about something else? :)

[Mikeyboy 27113]

..... they were asking for a ridiculous thing.. for someone who in the past.. may have seen (or does see) a transgendered person.... which again.. is a silly venture.. and a ton of work...(trying to keep all that in one's head simply to avoid seeing that person(s) -

 

I now read it (based on both the original post and the added information about his post from the other site) as being even more ridiculous than that. He seems to believe that we as hobbiests should be obligated to disclose to sp's that we have seen tgirls, and then you as sp's should be obligated to disclose in your ads and communications that you have seen us, in the interest of his safety.

 

This is wrong on so many levels. I mean, first off, we all know of course that ALL tgirls have multiple sti's and that the strait public has none. That's a reasonable assumption right?

 

That ridiculous (and highly prejudicial) assumption aside, does he actually believe that this idea is likely or even possible? I think that it's fairly safe to assume that everyone in this hobby on both sides has a reasonably extensive sexual history. The mathematics involved in keeping track of everyone's complete histories, as well as their partner's histories, their partner's histories, etc, etc are near impossible if you understand the exponential nature of this type of project.

 

Perhaps he should start with his own complete extended history. (Tgirls and all, and yes I bet that they are in there already somewhere by extension).

 

The hobby just doesn't work that way. If you aren't comfortable with the measures you are currently taking to mitigate your risk, then you need to reassess them, change them, or change hobbies.