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http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/parliament-hill-attacked-soldier-shot-at-national-war-memorial-in-ottawa-1.2808710 I can't beleive this is happening!

I don't understand what the issue is in regards to someone inquiring about specials...I see a lot of this on this site; women who seem quite bothered by every little question posed to them, even when the question was not aimed at them personally (as in this case). Yes, we get asked a lot of questions... yes, some of them are repetitive and get annoying... No, we should not jump down someone's throat for asking. Why does the "IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING NICE TO SAY, DON'T SAY ANYTHING AT ALL" not work both ways? Why is client-bashing OK? You see a question that you don't like seeing, simple: DON'T ANSWER. Move to the next thread... Why do we need to publicly humiliate people who don't see things the way we do? On a more related note, I do not offer "birthday specials", but if I did you can rest assured I would be asking for I.D. to prove it otherwise it would just be everyone's birthday everyday. If a regular client were to inform me it was his birthday, sure I would do something special for him, cake/cupcake or wine or maybe an extra sexy outfit, whatever. Even though I do not offer such specials, I'd like to high-five the OP for asking and not shame him into lurking but encourage him to post more, ask away my friend! I'm not one of those girls who blacklists people for asking my rates (yes, they are posted on my ads, god forbid someone ask me *eye roll* ) /endrant

I keep a client list too! Lee Richards: nickname "yah Baby", still needs to be shagged. RG: nickname "Virtual Hubby #1", honeymoon consumed. Repeat, yes! Magician: nickname "Hunny Bunny" and "Virtual Hubby #2", honeymoon consumed and a second one on the way! ETC... ;) Edit: I should add that my comment above was made tongue in cheek!

I keep a client list. It includes the bare minimum of info--phone number, first name and how the session went. It's not on my phone. I also keep accounting records, which include the date, a first name, the duration of the appointment and the donation given. I'd never release any of this info. I also like to think that most clients are able to distinguish individuals (eg. Terri Jean Bedford) from the community as a whole. What I mean is, if TJB releases her list, this is her individual action, not one that everyone agrees with. It also doesn't mean that the rest of us are about to follow in her footsteps if she does.

It doesn't surprise me at all. Given our foreign policy, treatment of Military Veterans, our track record with our Indigenous people, Palestine ... really ALL the bad decisions that our government has made is bound to come home to roost at some point. People are tired and those who feel it the hardest will eventually lash out. I'll be interested to see who takes responsibility and understand what has happened to them to bring it to this. There is always a reason, whether it is comprehensible or not by the general public. At least we know it wasn't the Pimp Lobby. There wasn't a pair of fishnets or a fedora in sight... cat

I keep a client list ......That's just how I roll. it's quite rather ridiculously short actually. 1 - 1 = ?

What I am confused about is why all the emphasis on not being able to advertise your services anymore? Who cares! Clients are booking us for our time and for who we are. Words and phrases like sensual and romantic or wild and adventurous can direct a client to the right lady as easy as listing a menu. I have never had a menu in the last 5 years(except when working with an agency in the past on occasion years back) nor will I discuss any services with anyone. Good clients don't care what burger toppings are awaiting them. They want to spend time with the lady who caught their attention. Call me naive but when people contact me to spend time with me, the email exchange is more on us getting to know one another and rarely if ever on can I get xxx and does yhc include ccc. (and yes 90% of those dates are declined and on my blog) Give it time, educate people and enjoy what comes from it. It will be a learning process for all of us.

OMG, the shit that we put in our bodies! For many it is a realistic hope that this will cure the bastard known as cancer. For most, it is a painful, exhausting way to "live". If you know someone going thru treatment, give them an unexpected hug, call, kiss. If you know someone REALLY well, give them a blow job, or offer to provide DATY until you both pass out. It is all really, really appreciated Tom TheLiquor

If you are worried about outing: unless you are Harper or MacKay, nobody cares about you (Note: This isn't an endorsement to out clients. But that's the reality. Who was the Alberta MP arrested for prostitution in the states again? If you remember his name, I congratulate you). Thank you Nicole for calling out the fear mongering. Just remember to be polite and nice before, during, and after your encounters and you won't have to worry about being on a bad date list! Besides, these are safety tools and if the police force a sex worker to hand over this information to avoid arrest, it just speaks volumes to the dangers involved with c-36 and it doesn't help the argument supporting the Bill. It provides support AGAINST the Bill. As I like to say, do good and be good!

Thanks for the post. Sky looks and sounds lovely.

My list mainly is nicknames, but do have Mike's, Bob's and Dan's. Whether or not that is their real name, I would not know. But that is the name they give me so I go with that. Even if it is their real name, no worries because our txt or email history is " hello are you free at noon today" No way of knowing what that means... free for a dog grooming( my other job), or free for a coffee, etc.. Obviously these are my regulars so not many notes are needed to remember the what and who's. For new clients, I only use a nick name after I have spent time with them, that way I know they have visited me at least once and do not need to screen them all over again. Nicknames will contain certain details, much like we have already read here in this thread " guy with beard" " nice guy, see again!" ..." very bad breath, no kiss but nice" lol But when screening a new client, I do have certain questions that need to be answered first, for my safety. Besides, doesn't make you feel more appreciated when we remember the fine details?

Of course some of the ladies have client lists! I don't write out a list on parchment with a broken crayon and nail it to the wall, vowing to ruin the lives of these clients but I do have an e-list: *to remember what I wore so I don't wear the same thing again the next time *Little details about the client if the client has a very common name (like Mike or Steve) *Some conversation/interaction with the client that we both really enjoyed. *To make dorky notes like 'great fun!' or 'loves history too!' or 'very proud of his daughter who just got into law school'. A few notes like this can bring back the whole experience when I next hear from this man. I like to think that TJ Bedford made that statement out of desperation because she wasn't being heard, and not out of real intent. If her plan was in fact to reveal the names publicly, I would not support that.

I only use cerb and merb so I can't comment on the others. Seeing as how out east we're limited in options cerb is the only real place where we can learn about new visits from touring ladies. I just learned about merb because I travel to Montreal frequently these days. I see that merb opened up an Atlantic Canada section in the last year, but it doesn't see much use. I honestly see cerb as more of a community board where clients and providers can congregate and discuss the issues of the business. I, unfortunately, personally do not trust cerb recommendations anymore, I've been burned too many times. Vagueness and limited information are the enemy of an informed client and that's all they seem to be. And only seeing one side of the coin (good vs. bad reviews) can be incredibly misleading. I'm also at the point in my hobbying career were sexual exploration is one of my primary objectives and this means I need to know what the lady is comfortable with. Asking her isn't enough, because you often just get a "maybe" or "if I'm up to it" so a detailed review can be a godsend to help me know what I can expect (easy example: almost every lady says she does DFK, but very few really do, and yes, I brush and mouth wash before every encounter ;)). I also find that some people embellish in their recommendations, for what reason I have no idea, but I can venture a guess. I also, don't feel comfortable expressing my opinion on certain topics here if it goes against the grain. I welcome spirited debate, but some you are just mean :sadomaso:. Now, don't take all of this as an attack on cerb. To be fair, merb has it's own problems. Some reviews can be just brutal, the issue with allowing negative comments is that some people don't know where to draw the line. There's a way to criticize properly and most people should have learned it in high school writing classes. But as always, anonymity + an audience can turn some people in raving keyboard warrior lunatics. There's also blatant and rampant favoritism among some of the senior members with regards to certain agencies. Which on it's face I have no issue with it, everyone has their go to agency, but when someone so obviously does and claims he doesn't when debating a related issue, it's laughable. And finally, the flame wars, debate can turn to horror in the blink of an eye. There are known rivalries and hatreds among certain members and it's painful to read through the mud they sling. Ultimately though, for me, it comes down to what am I looking for in an escort forum? For information about a lady I'm thinking of seeing, my preference is merb. To find out what's happening in the hobby world, cerb. As far as reviews vs. recommendations, I think it's best summed up by this, out of 40 or so meetings my current top 3 encounters are from ladies I researched on merb. My absolute two worst encounters (and these were laughably bad, if I had a few more I could write an erotic comedy novel) were unfortunately through cerb.

I can say from being with her that her pussy is very neat & tidy. It is always neatly trim. She is very accommodating and enjoys spending time with people. I enjoy the time we spend together. The truth is she is great person to spend a few hrs with and I enjoy that. All the ladies I've spent time with are more then just an SP they are people who I have become friends with and enjoy there company. I hope they also enjoy spending that time with me. :-)

Sarah, you keep saying this all over the place... do I really need to go into details on every single page? Ok, fine so hear goes... Signing the petition is only a small part of the big picture. As someone who is experienced with social media and how to promote a cause, whether signatures are recognized through the senate or not has little to do with it. When a person signs the petition and perhaps shares it, we continue to educate people. I haven't worked on this enough because I need to work to pay the bills as well. Someone who says they are retired and could be utilizing their time to help, seems to insist on doing what they can to avert people from signing the petition. I have always supported you in your endeavour to update us on Bill C-36; why you behave the way you do is beyond me. So YES, you should send in a letter, but as we all know, not many related to the industry are going to be willing to do that. That is what the Conservative Government is counting on. So the fact that I give a venue for ANYONE to say something and protest, is a GOOD thing, not a NEGATIVE thing. If we actually got the number of signatures that were possible if people actually spoke their mind, it may capture media attention.... I know the Bill will pass, but I encourage you to keep signing, as I am taking this all the way to the next election. It takes time to get people involved, it takes time to educate people on what is really happening, and it will take time to overturn this bill... that is why every step of the way we need to network and stick together. Evangline

Cancellation and no shows are never ok by either the provider or hobbyist. If there was a final confirmation was done, and then she no showed, this is unfortunate. Sorry if this happened. However, I have a concern with your comments about deposits and information. Any REPUTABLE provider would never keep a deposit if she has to cancel. She stands to loose more by doing this. Because you had a bad experience, please do not tar every provider with the same brush. Many of us strive to maintain a reputation of integrity. I once had a client who transfered the entire fee. Shortly after, I had to cancel for reasons out of my control. I immediately refunded the money back. We eventually did get to meet and had a wonderful time together. If your encounter was with someone who has no reputation, then maybe you need to explore those that strive to maintain a stellar reputation. I certainly hope this is not an attempt to air dirty laundry. Sometimes things happen, and hope she was able to make this up to you.

Hey ladies what is a major turn off when someone is looking to book a time with you ? One thing I absolutely hate is when someone texts me and says....What's up? Like really lol that will not grab my attention First impressions mean everything and I prefer a gentlemen being respectful and courteous when inquiring about my ......... For an example; Hello how are you or Hi I am .... and I am interested in knowing more about you and your ........!......so much better

After being on Cerb for over 3 years now. I've met many women from Cerb, of all sizes and races and ages. I've become on-line friends with many of them thou chat and PM's. I've also read most of the threads here and have come to the conclusion that the women that are the most successful and that I have had the best sessions with are women who truly love their work. I've learnt that some of these women started being an SP or MA due to personal circumstances. But have learnt that they actually enjoy doing this type of work and planned on doing it for as long as they can. These women enjoy giving and receiving pleasure and companionship. And as long as you are a gentleman and have good hygiene they welcome with you with open arms. And for the allocated time, they focus their attention on giving you companionship and pleasure. And if the chemistry is there and connection made. a friendship may be form where repeat encounters may occur with each one getting better and better as the comfort level and trust level form between two consenting adults. I have been lucky and have many encounters with kind loving women that I have continued contact with. Like any other job. If you truly love your work, and are good at it, success will come to you. This is a job where you can offer companionship and pleasure to men that are lonely or just lack the physical intimacy that humans need due to unfortunate circumstances. I am truly grateful to have met so many women that love their work and hope to meet many more. It really has changed my life. xoxoxox to all of you.

So here is my problem and any advice on how to handle it would be most appreciated. I go and see a new SP and have an intimate time. However that intimate time is missing a real sense of intimacy. So then another time I go back and see that same SP and by that time we are talking more and opening up about each others lives and then when the intimate time comes around I feel like I am using the lady. I know this is not real and realize without the exchange we do, this would not happen. However the most intimate time I am sharing is when we are not being intimate. I guess I just miss what it would be like to have a real girl friend/lover. I just miss making love. And yes I do think to much and I care about people. I need to figure out how I can do this, be fully satisfied and not just physically (because that part is easy) and not feel like the lady is doing this just because of the exchange we do. Knowing full well it is because of that exchange we are doing what we do. And please the problem is mine. Its certainly not a reflection on the beautiful lovely ladies I have met. Perhaps if they where all not so amazing in many ways this would be easier. Perhaps this is just not for me. Maybe I am looking to get to much out of this and should just keep things physical. But that is just not who I am. And because of personal circumstances beyond my control its either figure this out or be alone for the next several years.

What? My regular SP only charges me $80 and I can get it for $100 in Dream Land city. Why should I pay $200 US for the same thing with you?? And I can even get it for free anytime I want from non-escort women! Come on, gimme a good deal, RG! ;)

Funny, I've been advertising as if the law is in force. I've met many new wonderful clients that are fast becoming regulars. Not one has asked for specifics. Our time together has flowed beautifully, and I'm enjoying my time genuinely. Difference is that there are no longer scripted actions. It all flows nicely. I'm not complaining anymore about c36. It will get struck down. I still hate McKay and Harper, but it's gonna work out fine.

69 one of my faves - Lick Lick Slurp Slurp

Nothing wrong about keeping contact information on your friends and wives (ok wife) is there? ;-) And nothing wrong with getting together with your friends or wife is there? When seeing ladies I have already met, scheduling the date has nothing to do with services or donation or anything like that. It has to do with setting a date, place and time to get together again Frankly even with new ladies, booking an encounter is just about setting a date, place and time...with the addition I'll also provide screening/verification information too (btw that won't change, if a lady I want to see requires verification info it will still be provided) A quick rambling RG

I texted with her a bit last night but found her replies didn't really answer my questions and instead she just insisted that I come right away. One of my first messages said I was busy that night but was inquiring for the next day or two and her responses were still "come now" without actually answering my questions about BBBJ and MSOG.

Seen this girl last night. Not the one in the pics very cold personality need I say more wouldn't see again or recommend. To much body work.

There's no question those pics are all of Bella French , now the question is is Milan actually here or is some girl ripping off her pics. I think it may be her using an alias to keep a low profile in Halifax. Maybe we'll find out

Only the hard-copy petition on Elizabeth May's website can be presented in Parliament. You have to print it out and get actual signatures. I'm not saying don't sign the change.org one, but just know that she can't present that in parliament.

I have not met the other ladies mentioned but i can attest to the amazing fitness of Bianca Jaguar and her shape is all that more impressive when you consider she is in her fifties but has the body of a lady in her twenties. Just my opinion

Additional Comments:

This one was probably mentioned but here it comes again. What can I get for 100$?

Awwww Oooza booza !! ;) YO !!! Emma !! Remember that time I sent you a snap pic of my baby ? !!! Now keep in mind it was coooolllldddd out......shrinkage ?? and I have big hands :) Camera candids can be also fuzzy and pics out of focus.....or Out of site sometimes ........... ;)

I have to disagree with first impressions. They're are not everything. Some men just don't know what to say. I do agree with what's up, yo, babe, is all really a " crappy "way to introduce yourself, however I've met amazing men who have sent me an initial Yo. Lol. I speak for myself when I say keep in mind some men are new to this industry and aren't sure how to present themselves in our " required" commerce. Yourself, I and all of us Sps started out fresh, with no knowledge to wording, abbreviations etc, so shouldn't we give that benefit of the doubt to our prospective clients? (Pls don't gimme hostility for this post) as I'm purely stating my opinion. I'd feel sadly of anyone rejecting an amazing advanced client solely based on his initial hellos. Yet I truly get annoyed with the hey, or hi where are you emails and texts. Isn't that apart of our business?!?

I keep track of everyone. Regardless of status. I do this for reasons being, who are you. Some people change there contacts, others just do it for there own reasoning( beyond my comprehension) I would never contact anyone without them stating it's okay on this date/time etc... As goes for outing a client, I'd be more freaked out about him outing me a as well in some sort of sick retalitation. Old saying still implies do to others as you wish upon yourself.

http://www.someecards.com/usercards/viewcard/1610e2a36fb71ecd64cd96e457341cec7e

That's *how* clients are verified: people know them or they are arrested. All arrests are public knowledge. If a provider says she saw you in the public or media, nobody cares unless you are Harper or MacKay. ;) And as others have noted, it's not very professional to out a client and a reputable lady wouldn't do such a thing.

Booked a PSE experience duo with Bella and Kate. I have seen every girl sent here by BLE in the past, but never a duo. Planned in advance to make sure both girls were available when I wanted and booking them together was pretty easy. Confirmed the date the day of in the afternoon and got hotel info about and hour prior to the date. Arrived 15 minutes early and sent a text to let them know and got a quick reply to head on up.When I got to the room I was greeted by 2 very attractive women. They ushered me to the bed and both took off their bras and began to play with me and each other. They began to undress me and took turns with bbbj and then they began to perform bbbj together...very hot. After a few minutes of this they asked if I wanted the condom on and I said yes. The smaller girl, Bella got on top for some CG while Kate kissed her and me. Changed up, and Kate got on CG while Bella kissed me. After about 5 minutes I went back to Bella, this time doggy and watched as her and Kate did some dfk and played with each other's breasts. Switched back to Bella in missionary and was treated to a great view of both girls playing with each other. After that I decided that I wanted to taste the girls and I had Kate sit on my face while Bella performed another bbbj. Switched again and tasted Bella for aboit 10 minutes or so. At this point Kate almost finished me off with her bbbj and I decided that I wanted more of a show from them first. Told them to I wanted to see them daty with each other and they happily agreed. This went on for about 10 minutes and I got in behind each of the girls and performed oral on them while they took turns performing oral on each other. For the big finish I told them I wanted to COF both of them at the same time and they laid down together and began dfk and fondling each other again. Didn't take me long to get there and I finshed all over them and was treated to partial swallow with the rest rubbed into each other's breasts. Definitely the hottest time I have had with SP so far. I asked if they would be coming back so I could book a longer session as this was only an hour and I would really like msog for the next one. Total damage was $$$$$$$ but well worth it, and I would definitely see them again.

Some SPs are not into the menus so there may have to be bit of a different dialogue. To be honest, if someone starts naming off an alphabetical list of acronyms, it tells me a lot. I look for someone who genuinely wants to spend time with me aside from what type of services they will receive. When I see a person who lists acronyms, I am hesitant. I understand that there should be some sort of expectations in terms of what services will be received and not received but to me this is very impersonal and tells me what type of client they will be. A first impression is always a lasting one. If the person takes the time to communicate with me in more of a personable way while still being able to get their questions answered, it is more favorable. I am also more patient in this regard as I answer phone calls and texts all day long so I'm used to having more of a conversation. A conversation on the phone with a potential client will always give me a signal in 30 seconds or less if I want to meet them. It is all in the way they speak to me, the way they sound tells me their personality and the type of questions they ask, etc. I pick up on people's energy very quickly whether it's good or bad on the phone and in person. I will never specifically book just by text. It is crucial I hear the person's voice. Don't ask me why but my instincts always tell me yes or no within those 30 seconds. So while I don't have a lot of time, my brain and instincts are processing this info very quickly in how the person is reacting towards me and the questions they ask. I'm sure this works if an SP is more upfront in her ads and you want to confirm these services but we all run our business a different way. I thought it was cute when you put in "Hunnie" but I never use terms of endearment with my clients unless I've met them first. This comes off as very phony when you haven't met them. A different approach will need to be taken once this new bill becomes law.

For the most part, that is me as well. The first contact is through the email link in the website or sometimes via pm on boards (provided the SP has that option posted in her ad). In that initial contact is the phone # I will be contacting from as well to save confusion. One thing I would add is that in that first text, my first words are always, "Hello, my name is (insert first name), I am 54 yrs old and live in the area and saw your ad on CERB (or whatever). My handle there is "peacectryguy" Then the other pertinent stuff that was mentioned. I believe it is important to make an effort to show the lady you are on the level and a name and brief description does help in that. If they require more info, they can and will ask but it shows you are placing some trust in them and usually they feel better trusting you. It is a 2 way street.

I think with C36 it'll be dangerous to start talking/texting/emailing about money for services. Keep talk/texts/emails to money is for time and companionship, nothing about sex for money A rambling RG

Last thing You want to hear, 5am news repeating all the nonsense. Paraphrasing:a new study says girls as young as 13 are recruited in the thousands, and the handlers make 280k a year off each of them. All a rehash of the Joy Smith melodrama in her Senate presentation last week wrapped up as new. I expect better from the CBC. They should not be regurgitating this nonsense!

CERB isn't just a board, it's a community CERB isn't a boy's club, Ladies can come here and they feel safe. Here, we, ladies and gents alike are all opposite sides of the same coin, not us versus them RG

I've seen other hobbyists make reference to sps telling authorities who their clients are and really don't understand where this is coming from. Where is the logic of this? She makes no money from this, looses her clients and can't make new clients. Why would she do this? I sure as hell would never "help" the authorities get prosecutions under this law.

Every provider has different policies, and with my policies, if I have a deposit or pre-pay and I cannot show for some reason, a full refund goes to the client. If an appointment is pre-paid and the client doesn't show, and there is no notice whatsoever, he therefore forfeits the payment. Circumstances do come up either way. Clients spouse/family member suddenly drops in at the worst possible moment, has car trouble, can't get out of a meeting in time to make it, there are lots of reasons. Providers have outside influences also, a client that went overtime and I can't find a gracious way to ask him to leave (in this case I've gone to the ladies room and texted I am going to be late would you like to reschedule or cancel, hence the importance of a contact number), car trouble, a host of problems. We providers tend to look at all the problems that may arise, and find a way around them. I would never just not show up for someone without a damn good excuse as to why. We providers do receive a lot of no shows, its part of this business, and we have to accept it. If the lady in question did take a prepayment, or deposit, from you, then you are entitled (in my opinion) to compensation for the no show. if it was just a pre-booking, then neither of you are obligated to the other for anything, except perhaps her reputation. If it was just a few hours of her not showing up, give her the benefit of the doubt. Contact her to find out if she is ok, and if you can reschedule, then you may find out what happened.

I am going to repeat the obvious which is SOP: always get paid upfront, and remove the $$ from the view of the client. No exceptions. it is especially simple in a spa setting, the attendant makes the agreement, then takes the $$ out to the front desk attendant for safe keeping. Other than that, there are dbs out there, like this guy, and once they know they can get away with it, they continue to try to do the same thing at other places with the same policies of post payment. Which is why it is never good for clients to brag or mention seeing any MA or SP who accepts payment after session, this kind of guy is looking for that kind of provider.

Without a doubt I am and always will be a cat lover. I've got a soft spot for adopted kittens. My sassy side kick is a feisty Calico, would like to adopt another one in the near future. Jas.

You should see Clarissa Delight and I eat crab legs ;)

I get different fantasies every week but I guess right now it would be a threesome but starting off as a twosome. Here is what i mean by that, me in a room with a lady and we are kissing and caressing each other and another lady could be watching us and she would get aroused by seeing us. She would eventually join us and there would be lots of kissing and helping one an other into mind blowing sex.

Assuming different options are available with GFE or PSE will only make you mad when you find out these are not available from some ladies. GFE and PSE are "STYLES of SERVICE" and not actual services!! You CAN NOT assume PSE or GFE include any specific services. STYLES.... Mechanical Style: This means no chemistry and just what it is (Sex) no illusion of lust or passion. GFE: Girl friend experience (Does not include specific services) this is a style of date where chemistry is tried to be created, feelings of lust and passion. Usually includes kissing and a more intimate fantasy. The lady appears (and often is) genuinely interested in pleasing you and often enjoys being pleasured as well. PSE: Porn star experience (Does not include specific services) this is also a style of date. It is not a romantic/passion/chemistry type encounter it is like what you see in the porn movies (A little dirty and hardcore) SAFE PSE/GFE: means condoms are used for oral sex (and possibly DATY protection is used) - Some girlfriends and porn stars insist on condoms for everything too guys! CONDOMS are used IN ALL STYLES (Some people assume condoms are not used with these styles as often real girl friends and porn stars do not use condoms). DO NOT ASSUME THIS AS YOU WOULD BE VERY WRONG - IT IS UNSAFE TO HAVE UNPROTECTED SEX! You guys who assume services are included in these styles are setting yourself up to be let down. Just because one lady offers specific services (and possibly markets it as GFE/PSE does not mean the next lady will offer the same services. They are usually similar as a really good GFE would include kissing, bbbj and some touching and rubbing to build chemistry and fantasy. If you feel she is actually attracted to you and into the encounter she may be (or she may be VERY good at her job - just go with it!) Don't EXPECT any services - always ask or research first and if you show up with bad breath, rotten teeth, bad hygiene or dressed like a bum chances are you are going to be even more disappointed. In Addition: One of the ladies PM'd me to mention that one of the reasons ladies may not kiss is from being unshaven. A lot of stubble can do a girl some major damage. I would assume this to be true with DATY as well with some.